2-3" Midrange

[megamuel]

Any recommendations for a good 2 or 3 inch midrange? Its to go with HiVi F8 driver and HiVi RT1C-A Ribbon tweeter. I was going to go with the HiVi F5 but I was told that I may need a bigger woofer or smaller midrange. Although I like the idea of having a bigger woofer - the cabinets would probably end up bigger than my room! Oh and I want to keep the budget down as it is my first experimental project! So smaller midrange it is, any ideas?

Cheers,

Sam.

[Mazeroth]

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=285-020&CFID=7158225&CFTOKEN=93161557

The RS52 is a wide bandwidth, low distortion mid that should work well with the intended drivers. Zaph reviewed it here near the bottom:

http://zaphaudio.com/smalltest/

[megamuel]

Thanks for quick reply. I did look at that mid - it is rated very well. However, I am not too sure about its appearance.. It doesn't really light my fire, but I am not ruling it out as sound is definately more important. Is there anything that is available through madisound as I am hoping to take advantage of their LEAP crossover design service... Or do you know any other companies that will design and build crossovers? Cheers!

[ThomasW]

Most chose performance over looks, when it comes to drivers.

The LEAP designs are done using the factory plots, they lack baffle step compensation and zobels. So they're better than a generic crossover but they're not optimized to your box.

IMO you'd be better off building someone's proven design. That way you can invest the money in the components and not spend it paying anyone to do the design work.

[peter_m]

If keeping the budget on the low side and physical size is also an issue, why don't you consider a 7" or 8" two way?

http://www.markk.claub.net/RS225_RS28A_updates/dayton_reference_rs225.htm

http://www.htguide.com/forum/showthread.php4?t=13154&page=1&pp=35

http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker17.html

http://zaphaudio.com/blog.html Soon to be released new ER18 design.

These all have been tested and built by many people and allow you to build your own x-over without having to depend on someone else. Something to consider...

Peter

[megamuel]

Most chose performance over looks, when it comes to drivers.

I know this thats why I said I wasn't ruling it out. I was just hoping that there might be something that I liked the appearance of as well as having a good performance as aesthetics is quite important to me. I see what your saying about building a proven design. I know this way I'll get a better sound but I find the building of a crossover quite daunting! Thats why I was looking at having having a custom built crossover and just accepting that they won't sound 'as' good. Is the crossover for the Khansphires hard to built?? Thanks,

Sam

[ThomasW]

Is the crossover for the Khansphires hard to built?? Thanks,

I've heard that name but know nothing about the speaker. A google search for "Khansphires" turns up nothing. Got a link?

[cjd]

Khanspire - one little spelling mistake makes for search miseries.

It's Ryan's project. You can ask Ryan how difficult he found it. I don't think crossovers are hard to assemble, but I don't get confused reading the diagrams either and some do. So, hard to answer. They're not as bad as some.

I should publish the final crossover, which is slightly different than what Ryan's used but is quite close. In fact... I'll do that in a second here.

C

[ThomasW]

Silly me, I just don't think of Ryan's project with that particular name.. ops:

3-way crossover are twice as complicated as a 2-way. Any of them are fairly easy to build if there are pictures of the crossover boards. Most find building from a schematic troublesum. If pics aren't available sometime 'nice' designers will create block diagrams for the n00bs to follow..

[cjd]

Yeah, I can whip up a block diagram. I think Ryan actually came up with a very slick layout on his boards.

[Dennis H]

Didn't someone recently say Meniscus and or Madisound would assemble crossovers from your schematic for a nominal fee if you bought the components from them? Email them the schematic and get a quote for an assembled crossover?

[ThomasW]

I think that was Meniscus...

The reality is these XO's aren't that complicated. If one has adequate soldering skills and a block diagram, assembly should be pretty straight forward.

[---k---]

The Khanspires were the first crossover I've ever attempted to assemble. The first one took me probably 4 hours to understand the diagram, lay things out, and then wire it all together. The second one took me a lot less time.

I would love to have someone else build the Khans. My ego is suffering from all these people building the Statements. With decent diagrams and good pictures, it isn't really that hard. I think most people could do it, if they were willing to try. And, we're all here to help. After you get it done, if you have any doubts you can post pictures for us to check.

I would definitely build a project from here, whether it be mine, one of Jon's or the Statements. It will be a much better investment. It would just be such a shame to spend more money and get less. Also, you also get a huge sense of accomplishment when you do everything yourself.

[Brian Bunge]

Yeah, I just saw Ryan's xo pics in the Khanspires thread. Geez. As my step-daughter would say, "Easy Peasy Lemon Squeezy". Especially after wiring up 20+ 10uF caps in parallel to get the values needed.

[---k---]

I think you're misinterpreting the photos on the 20+10uF caps. Those aren't in parallel.

All values of caps should be available straight up from Dayton, except for the 180uF, which I used 90+90. In my photos, I have a 7.5+1.5 to get the right value, because it was a mod after the initial part order.

[Brian Bunge]

Ryan,

I meant wiring up 20 different 10uF caps to get 200uF caps. I measured each individually, added up their values and then supplemented with some 5uF's some .6uF's (or whatever they were) in order to get as close to the exact value as possible.

[ThomasW]

I would love to have someone else build the Khans. My ego is suffering from all these people building the Statements.

You just need the Jim Holtz marketing juggernaut to help speed things along...

[Jim Holtz]

You just need the Jim Holtz marketing juggernaut to help speed things along...

Did I mention, that in a previous life, I was in advertising for 17 years? :B

Jim

[Jed]

You just need the Jim Holtz marketing juggernaut to help speed things along...

Or use the same drivers he does and mix up the cabinets a bit. :B

Honestly, Jim is a hearfelt kinda guy and very polite or straight to the point when he needs to be. Jim, will you run for president? You got my vote.

[cjd]

Yeah, Jim's OK even if he does like the TBFC/G better than the TDFC.

I actually got told off once for "constantly hyping my designs"

C

[megamuel]

Oh God I don't know what to do!!! I am determined to build a pair of speakers. I don't want to give up on the idea like everything else I have tried in my life, I'm just not sure that I can do it! :cry: I need a mentor!!!

[Jed]

Oh God I don't know what to do!!! I am determined to build a pair of speakers. I don't want to give up on the idea like everything else I have tried in my life, I'm just not sure that I can do it! :cry: I need a mentor!!!

Start small and work your way up to a big speaker as you gain experience.

[ThomasW]

Building speakers and designing speakers are two completely different things.

Building virtually anyone one can do with assistance. Designing is a completely different thing.

If you choose to build one of the designs posted on this forum you'll have a ton of support. That's one reasons why we're here (we'd rather see n00b succeed instead of fall flat on their face.... )

If you insist on randomly choosing cool looking drivers and getting one of the driver supply companies to create the crossover, we're pretty much out of the loop.

[---k---]

I need a mentor!!!

Like many here, I didn't know a thing about woodworking or speaker building when I got here. The guys here like Thomas, Jon, CJD are all great in mentoring us in building something great.

There are a lot of already great designs here. No need to reinvent the wheel (although I guess I did. ). Just pick a design you like, and then read the build thread, and jump in. We'll hold you're hand as you go.

And if you wait a couple of days, I'm sure there will be plenty of good reviews from Iowa of the Statements, Khanspires, and the good old NatP, ModulaMT, and several other designs. It should help you decide.

BTW, what is your budget and goals?

[Brian Bunge]

And tell us where you live. You never know, someone here might be able to give a little hands on help.

[megamuel]

I am from the UK so unfortunately this means added shipping costs because I don't know of companies like parts express or madisound here in the UK. You're all from the US and Canada right? As for goals, well I want a pair of floorstanding speakers for my bedroom which is approx 3x4m. Obviously I want something with a good sound for music and movies but aesthetics is quite important too, but my mail goal is to have a hobby that I can have some fun with and learn some new things. My amp is the NAD C 320BEE how does this affect the type of speaker I should build in terms of power... I guess I could save up for a new amp if necessary. My budget for the speakers? I don't really want to spend anymore that £500 ($1000?) but can stretch if persuaded!

Sam

[---k---]

$1000USD here goes a long way. The driver and crossovers in mine came to ~$650 and the wood and other misc. parts probably brought the total to $800. So, should be able to come up with something for you.

Probably best to find out what you can get your hands on driver wise. There are a lot of people here from the international community, so we understand. You'll probably be looking for places that sell Peerless Drivers or Seas.

Check out Zaph's site. I can't think off hand of a floorstander of his, but he has lots of good designs that use drivers that may be easier for you to get your hands on. He also pops in here once in a while, and we can probably help you with his designs.

And also note that many of the larger 2-way systems can be built as either big bookshelves or as floorstanders. Customation is always possible.

(and put UK in your messageboard profile)

[megamuel]

Just out of interest, what does everyone make of these:

http://www.iplacoustics.co.uk/ipl_s3tl_mk3_transmissionline.htm

Might be a better way for me to enter the world of speaker building? Why is the tweeter mounted below the woofer? Isn't it better for the tweeter to be mounted above the woofer or did I get that wrong? Or does it not matter? Just curious...

[cjd]

If you're not up to the woodworking, possibly. Their crossover approach is unlikely to get anything other than skeptical sideways glances around here though, and Hi-Vi isn't known for superb tweeters. Overall, not sure the value is there but they may be decent.

Tweeter is usually on top to keep it at ear height. Putting it under changes the lobing behavior - not necessarily a problem if it was designed to work that way.

C

[megamuel]

Hi-Vi isn't known for superb tweeters.

C

I think the tweeter is a SEAS H881. Any good? I'd like to do the woodworking but I'd need to by a band saw and other equipment which would be costly. Thats why I was thinking maybe have a go at something like this and see how it goes before investing in a lot of expensive equipment. Just looking at all my options really...

[cjd]

You can build speaker boxes with a circular saw (+ sawboard) and a router. And clamps. But you'd need clamps for a kit box too.

C

[megamuel]

Hmmm.... Seems I have some decision making to do! Right, I'm off to work now, that seems like a good place to think about speakers.... Thanks for your advice cjd - very helpful

Sam

[jdybnis]

The purists will shudder, but you can use screws instead of clamps. You take out the screws before you veneer and fill in the holes.