Statements and newbie to building

[rick844]

Ah, many thanks.

[rick844]

Question, is it possible to widen the front baffle of the anthology tower design to cover the exposed sides if using Baltic birch? I noticed that was how the flat pack was designed at speaker design works but I wasnt sure if that would affect the sound. Obviously I would shorten the side panels to accommodate and avoid changing the internal volume of the cabinet.

[Jim Holtz]

Question, is it possible to widen the front baffle of the anthology tower design to cover the exposed sides if using Baltic birch? I noticed that was how the flat pack was designed at speaker design works but I wasnt sure if that would affect the sound. Obviously I would shorten the side panels to accommodate and avoid changing the internal volume of the cabinet.

Speakers with open back mids have two dimensions that are critical. Width and depth. You can increase/decrease them up to 10% without impacting the crossover but no more than that. The reason is the front sound wave needs to blend with the reflected rear sound wave to sound as designed.

HTH

Jim

[rick844]

Thanks Jim. So by widening the front baffle by 1.5 inches compared to original design it be too wide compared to the original design by just over 3/8". Hmm.

[rick844]

This may push me back to MDF and veneer.

[Jim Holtz]

Thanks Jim. So by widening the front baffle by 1.5 inches compared to original design it be too wide compared to the original design by just over 3/8". Hmm.

The 10% is just a guideline based on Curt's recommendations. However, this is DIY and you can do whatever you want to see what happens. Previous builders of our designs have created round, curved, shorter, deeper and wider cabinets. We've not heard the results of their redesigns so we can't give a stamp of approval. 10% is a safe recommendation but its your build so you can do what you like.

How's that for an ambiguous answer? :W

Jim

[rick844]

Lol, I get it. I want to stay as close to your guys design as I dont want to ruin the sound especially with what I will have invested. I just need to decide if i can learn how to veneer. I've heard they have veneer that can be ironed on, but not sure if that will be a quality setup. I also reached out to Rick for the center upgrade you suggested and it's a very reasonable solution, so thanks again for that. I will start a new thread detailing both projects so as to help someone else going down the same path as I am. I really do appreciate all the expert help you guys have provided. I want quality sound and quite frankly, best buy just doesnt have quality stuff. Plus the pride in building something is really of interest. My true long term plan is to get into designing and building my own, but I have a ton to learn before I'm ready for that.

[1Michael]

I tried the iron on veneer method when I built Jon's Nat P's. Never again...

[rick844]

Thanks for that feedback. I was thinking that it sounded too easy.

[Jim Holtz]

Here's my $0.02 worth...

I would recommend 10 mil paper back veneer unless you have access to a vacuum press. 10 mil goes on easily and looks nice. I've used both the iron on method and contact cement and much prefer high quality contact cement. Veneer Supplies (Joe the wood worker), Tapease and Oakwood are my favorite veneer companies. All offer high quality and I shop with whoever has the best price on the variety I want. I also have had excellent luck with Veneer Supplies Better Bond Titan DX™ Premium Contact Cement and 3M water based contact cement. Both are very low VOC products.

Buy a veneer scraper for assembly rather than a roller. It works better and seals the veneer to the cabinet surface much better than a roller. Have help to handle large sheets of veneer. Over cut the veneer so you don't come up short. Trimming veneer is easy. Extra hands are essential. I also have several dowels that I bought at the local home store to keep the veneer off the cabinet surface while applying it until you're ready for it to be applied.

Check you tube for veneer how to's

There are many many accomplished cabinet builder on this forum that can offer better advice than I. When you get to that point, start a specific thread about veneering. They'll jump in.

HTH

Jim

[rick844]

I will do that, thanks again Jim!

[CADman_ks]

Here's my $0.02 worth...

I would recommend 10 mil paper back veneer unless you have access to a vacuum press. 10 mil goes on easily and looks nice. I've used both the iron on method and contact cement and much prefer high quality contact cement. Veneer Supplies (Joe the wood worker), Tapease and Oakwood are my favorite veneer companies. All offer high quality and I shop with whoever has the best price on the variety I want. I also have had excellent luck with Veneer Supplies Better Bond Titan DX™ Premium Contact Cement and 3M water based contact cement. Both are very low VOC products.

...

Check you tube for veneer how to's

There are many many accomplished cabinet builder on this forum that can offer better advice than I. When you get to that point, start a specific thread about veneering. They'll jump in.

HTH

Jim

Check the Youtube stuff when you're ready. There is a LOT out there.

I personally have never done anything but the iron on method, with PVA glue that I applied. It is just so forgiving, I think. Knock on wood (no pun intended, well maybe), but I have never had any come loose (yet).

My advice would be, if you're fairly new to woodworking, go with the iron method. You can position it wherever you want, UNTIL you start ironing, and then it's set. It is definitely a slower method, but it is pretty "easy" I think, and very very forgiving when applying. Other's mileage may vary.

There's my veneer advice, BEFORE you start the thread.

[rick844]

Lol, thanks. I may try samples of both to see how it goes. I did watch a few videos last night and it looks straight forward. It seems the key in both processes was good solid clamping or pressure. Fixturing will be needed so I can make some things and try some samples to get an idea. Thanks again guys. One of the most helpful forums I have been on.

[CADman_ks]

... It seems the key in both processes was good solid clamping or pressure. ...

If you're talking the veneering process, you shouldn't need any clamping at all with the iron PVA method, or at lease I never have. I simply get the veneer where I want it, simply by holding it, or maneuvering around, then I start ironing one corner working my way across and down. Once it's all basically "stuck", I go back over the entire thing, making sure that it is fully ironed down adequately...

[rick844]

Thanks for the info cadman.

[rick844]

Question about the center crossover. Since I will be converting to 3 way and replacing crossover, should I do anything different to the rear port or crossover to account for the fact that it will be inside the entertainment center?

[Jim Holtz]

Question about the center crossover. Since I will be converting to 3 way and replacing crossover, should I do anything different to the rear port or crossover to account for the fact that it will be inside the entertainment center?

Rick used to provide the built crossover. I don't know what he's doing now. The crossover isn't impacted by a ported or sealed cabinet. But if the port can't breathe freely, it needs to. sealed won't make a difference other than a cabinet sitting in an entertainment center is not different than a cabinet flush mounted in a wall which does impact the crossover. This is a conversation you need to have with Rick before ordering.

HTH

Jim

[rick844]

Thank Jim, Rick did quote the crossover. I will ask his advice on recommendations if any on the crossover then. So based on what I think you are saying, he can adjust the crossover if I was to try and seal the cabinet?

[Jim Holtz]

Thank Jim, Rick did quote the crossover. I will ask his advice on recommendations if any on the crossover then. So based on what I think you are saying, he can adjust the crossover if I was to try and seal the cabinet?

Sealed cabinet mean no port. The crossover isn't impacted if there is a port or no port. But, the crossover is impacted if the center speaker is in wall or in an entertainment center as yours is. Crossover designers compensate for the normal bass rolloff in a speaker from 800 Hz down to 100 Hz of up to 6 db. The closer you move the speaker to the wall, the less bass roll off but the flattest soundstage in a stereo speaker. In a center channel if the crossover is designed with bass compensation for normal away from wall positioning of 3 to 6 db, the bass will provide an unpleasant "chesty" quality to deep male vocals when moved close to the wall or placed in wall. On the flip side if there's not enough bass compensation built into the crossover, the speaker has a thin sound to it that is also less pleasant.

If I've not totally confused you, speaker positioning does matter as does the how the crossover is designed to accommodate where the speaker is positioned. Rick will compensate in the crossover for your center channel positioning which is the same as in/on wall mounting to eliminate the "chesty" voice sound. Just tell him where the center will be placed and he'll compensate accordingly.

If your cabinet is ported, you must have the speaker positioned at least the distance equal to the port diameter away from the wall behind it. More is better so it can breathe.

While we're talking about positioning, the Anthology's, Statements, Bordeaux etc. all require a minimum of 12" distance from the side and rear of the cabinets with no large furniture between them that is taller than the top of the top bass driver. They are designed to reflect the back sound wave from the open rear mid tunnels and blend with the front sound wave and open up the soundstage. The foam in the tunnels eliminate any "smearing" effect from too much reflection. Correct positioning is important for best sound.

HTH

Jim

[rick844]

Thanks Jim! Very educational. I won't have any issues positioning the anthologys 12 inches away from the wall and there is only a TV in between them above 26inches off of the floor, so that should be good. I'm getting excited to start the build and getting the MDF Friday. I will begin cutting the pieces and I'll take photos along the way and post to the other thread I started. Once I start with the center channel upgrade I'll do one for that too.

[Jim Holtz]

Thanks Jim! Very educational. I won't have any issues positioning the anthologys 12 inches away from the wall and there is only a TV in between them above 26inches off of the floor, so that should be good. I'm getting excited to start the build and getting the MDF Friday. I will begin cutting the pieces and I'll take photos along the way and post to the other thread I started. Once I start with the center channel upgrade I'll do one for that too.

Excellent! :T

Jim