John's Statement build

[Jim Holtz]

I messed up when I bought the foam (6 months ago). I only bought enough for two tunnels...duh!!!! So I cut the foam and lined one tunnel on each speaker.

The local fabric store has the 1" foam in 15" x 17" pieces, which is a perfect size. One sheet per tunnel, with almost no waste material (yeah, I'm one of those eco-friendly guys). The only down-side is having to walk into a fabric store again...I truly feel out of place there!

Don't forget to bevel the driver end of the foam at 45 degrees and hold the foam back from the front baffle about 1 1/2" - 2".

Jim

[john trials]

Don't forget to bevel the driver end of the foam at 45 degrees and hold the foam back from the front baffle about 1 1/2" - 2".

Jim

Yup. I cut the foam 45 degrees, and gave the mids some room. Before I started on this Statement build, I read the entire Mission Accomplished thread and took notes. That was very helpful.

Jim, you are truly a nice guy, looking after all of us Statement builders...Thank you.

[sawdust]

Don't forget to bevel the driver end of the foam at 45 degrees and hold the foam back from the front baffle about 1 1/2" - 2".

Jim

Jim, is the 1 1/2 - 2" significant? I have the 45 degree beveled end all the way forward.

[john trials]

Jim, is the 1 1/2 - 2" significant? I have the 45 degree beveled end all the way forward.

It's easy enough to test, if your ears are sensitive enough (mine probably aren't!). Pull your foam out 2" (that sounds dirty, doesn't it) and see if if makes a difference. At least your foam is too long. It can easily be trimmed.

[sawdust]

It's easy enough to test, if your ears are sensitive enough (mine probably aren't!). Pull your foam out 2" (that sounds dirty, doesn't it) and see if if makes a difference. At least your foam is too long. It can easily be trimmed.

What am I listening for? Increased clarity. I'm not sure my ears are good enough either, but with all the time and effort I've put into these, I want the very best possible sound. I started my Statement Center channel build this weekend, so quality home theater here I come.

[Curt C]

I suspect you will find the midrange and lower treble will become more 'alive' when you move the foam back. Find the best compromise for you over several listening sessions and differring souce material. Start out at 2" and tweak from there. The 'extra' foam hanging out the back will have no effect.

C

[lunchmoney]

WOW... nice job, John! Absolutely beautiful. I've gotta get over and hear them some day.

[john trials]

Last night I did some comparison listening (at the rear of the speakers). Since each Statement has one mid-tunnel lined with foam and one empty right now, it was easy to compare one to the other. It is amazing how much the sound coming out of the tunnel is attenuated by the foam.

Just because I'm curious, I may have to hook up a microphone and make some measurements. I'd like to see how much that attenuation is, but also, if it is an equal amount for all frequencies. I'm lacking in test equipment, but maybe an FFT in Audacity will work.

Is there any way to model this? I'm not going to change anything in the design of the Statements. I'm just interested in the effects of the foam.

[Curt C]

Somewhere on this forum, probably in Jim's original Statement thread, I believe I posted a plot of a near field measurement of the Statement mid tunnel. If I recall correctly, it had a 2nd order roll off at around 2K.

C

[john trials]

Before I built my Statements, I read just about every build thread here. I don't recall seeing any Statements with grills (I think I saw Jim H's Mini Statements with grills), so I thought I'd post pictures of mine. They are nothing fancy, just basic rectangles. I kind of like the look (although I like the look of no grills, too, which is why I used magnets for retaining the front grills).

It's been about five weeks since the last tung oil coating, and they are finally fully dried!!!!!

[Jim Holtz]

Very nice John! :T

Jim

[sawdust]

John,

I like! What do you have driving them? Receiver or separates?

I'm about done with the Statements center channel to complete the Statements trifecta.

[john trials]

John,

I like! What do you have driving them? Receiver or separates?

I'm about done with the Statements center channel to complete the Statements trifecta.

I have an old Yamaha R-8 receiver (from 1983). 200W per channel into 4 ohms. Also a fairly old Sony CD player. Nothing special (which is why they are not in any of the photos in my thread!). I'd like to upgrade sometime (the Emotiva stuff is all on sale now...it's killing me!). My receiver is fine, but a new CD unit would be nice. I'm anticipating a layoff, so I'm just enjoying what I have right now.

[sawdust]

I have a Parasound 2100 preamp driving the Emotiva XPA-2. Very nice sounding with the Statements. That amp really made a big difference in the sound quality. Heck it's Christmas time. Buy yourself a present! :W

[john trials]

I just bought a bicycle (I bike year-round) that was on year-end closeout (26% off), plus I had a 20% coupon. It was a better deal than the Emotiva stuff, so I got it.

I would like to try that XPA-2 with Emotiva's preamp and CD player....maybe someday.

[BeerParty]

Before I built my Statements, I read just about every build thread here. I don't recall seeing any Statements with grills (I think I saw Jim H's Mini Statements with grills), so I thought I'd post pictures of mine. They are nothing fancy, just basic rectangles. I kind of like the look (although I like the look of no grills, too, which is why I used magnets for retaining the front grills).

Very nice! Quick question for you - in the pictures you can see the outline of the drivers through the grills. Can you see them in person, or is that a photo effect from the flash?

[john trials]

Very nice! Quick question for you - in the pictures you can see the outline of the drivers through the grills. Can you see them in person, or is that a photo effect from the flash?

It's partially from the flash, but in normal room light, you can see the mids, just slightly at certain angles, because they are so light in color. In normal room light, you definitely can't see the grill frame cutouts.

[john trials]

I have a Parasound 2100 preamp driving the Emotiva XPA-2. Very nice sounding with the Statements. That amp really made a big difference in the sound quality. Heck it's Christmas time. Buy yourself a present! :W

I was thinking the Emotiva ERC-1 (CD unit) into a USP-1 (preamp) then the XPA-2 (power amp) would be a nice addition to my Statement speakers. The USP-1 doesn't have any balanced ins/outs, but the ERC-1 and XPA-2 do. I thought this was strange, so I contacted Emotiva. A balanced preamp is in the works and should be available sometime in early 2010.

It may be worth the wait!

[savage25xtreme]

I was thinking the Emotiva ERC-1 (CD unit) into a USP-1 (preamp) then the XPA-2 (power amp) would be a nice addition to my Statement speakers. The USP-1 doesn't have any balanced ins/outs, but the ERC-1 and XPA-2 do. I thought this was strange, so I contacted Emotiva. A balanced preamp is in the works and should be available sometime in early 2010.

It may be worth the wait!

The general consensus that I have heard/read, unless you are going to have a LONG cable (20 ft or more) between your preamp and amp you wont know the difference. I would stick with good RCAs.

[john trials]

The general consensus that I have heard/read, unless you are going to have a LONG cable (20 ft or more) between your preamp and amp you wont know the difference. I would stick with good RCAs.

I normally would just use RCA connectors (and I do with my current system), but since the Emotiva CD source and the power amp both have balanced connectors, it'd be nice to use them. Plus, with the usual rat's nest of wiring behind my system, twisted-shielded cable would be a good thing.

[john trials]

Statements Part II

Well, I'm getting carried away with this hobby. Back in Feb. I started to make some Statement Monitors and a CC using the leftover MDF I had laying around the basement. Progress has been slow, but I've bought almost all of the drivers, the crossovers are built, and it's time to get serious and finish these.

I bought an Onkyo TX-SR707, and I'm also building a huge sonosub (http://techtalk.parts-express.com/sh...d.php?t=217880) to go with this system. I've never even heard/listened to a 5.1 system, but soon I'll have one to try out!

I apologize to anyone who has read my thread and been disappointed by not being able to see the pictures. The site where I had my photos uploaded was hacked, and not functioning for 5 weeks. Everything from 2009 was lost. I've finally updated my build thread with the photos.

[john trials]

Here are some photos that show how I build the baffles. I keep the 1/2" and 3/4" pieces separate until they are complete and ready to be glued to the rest of the cabinet. I use short sections of bicycle spokes (2 per cabinet) as pins to position the baffle pieces. That way I can very accurately position them on the cabinet for fitting/marking, then remove them and do the necessary cuts. Keeping the 2 baffle pieces separate also allows me to make some pretty large back-cuts on the inside, for good driver air flow.

I first take both baffles pieces and line them up on the cabinet to drill the pin holes. Then from the rear of the tunnel,I reach through the tunnel and mark the 5" square on the back side of the 1/2" baffle with a pencil. On the baffles, I use this 5" square to make all of my relative measurements for cutting all of the holes on the baffle. I drill 1/8" holes in the centers of each driver.

I cut the 3/4" baffle first. Rebates (counterbores), then through holes. Then I cut the chamfers. I go out almost to the 5" square for the mid, and cut the same amount for the woofer. It leaves less than 1/8" near the rebate. I use the chamfers to mark the circular hole on the 1/2" baffle (which is not very circular in this photo...I had to do things in a rush this morning, as it is now raining!).

On the 1/2" baffle, I rough cut the 5" cutout, and flush cut it when it is finally glued to the cabinet.

1/2" baffle on the left.........................3/4" baffle on right

[john trials]

Here is a detailed photo of the midrange chamfer on the 3/4" thick baffle. I don't leave much material near where the driver flange will be.

[john trials]

Crossover photos are already posted; https://www.htguide.com/forum/showpo...3&postcount=13

I used broken broom/rake handles for the crossover standoffs. Good hard wood, cheap.

[john trials]

The subwoofer for my 5.1 Statement system is completed (Ascendant Audio Avalanche 18" driver). Now I've got to get going finishing the CC and Monitors. For size reference, that is a 4 foot tall Tritrix TL and a 2 cuft RSS315HF subwoofer in the photo also. This thing is 24" diameter x 80" tall overall. f3 is about 15-16Hz. The port is tuned to 13.5Hz.

[john trials]

I've read quite a few Statement Monitor threads, but I've never seen this question:

Would the port function better if it was offset to the side a few inches in the Statement Monitors?

The inner flare of the port is only 1.13" from the rear side of the Fountek tweeter (if I did my math correctly), which seems like it would restrict the airflow characteristics of the port. I've heard Beerparty's Monitors, and the bass sounded really nice, so maybe I'm just being a little too analytical. But maybe the low end could improve by moving the port?

[Fdas]

I've read quite a few Statement Monitor threads, but I've never seen this question:

Would the port function better if it was offset to the side a few inches in the Statement Monitors?

The inner flare of the port is only 1.13" from the rear side of the Fountek tweeter (if I did my math correctly), which seems like it would restrict the airflow characteristics of the port. I've heard Beerparty's Monitors, and the bass sounded really nice, so maybe I'm just being a little too analytical. But maybe the low end could improve by moving the port?

Thats an interesting question. I haven't put the port in yet on my Monitors so I too am interested in the answer.

[Curt C]

I've read quite a few Statement Monitor threads, but I've never seen this question:

Would the port function better if it was offset to the side a few inches in the Statement Monitors?

The inner flare of the port is only 1.13" from the rear side of the Fountek tweeter (if I did my math correctly), which seems like it would restrict the airflow characteristics of the port. I've heard Beerparty's Monitors, and the bass sounded really nice, so maybe I'm just being a little too analytical. But maybe the low end could improve by moving the port?

To the best of my knowledge, while the port proximity to the ribbon has never caused any audible issues, I see no problem with offsetting the port if you'd like.

In addition, one could add another layer of MDF to the rear baffle around the port flare, and gain another three quarters of an inch of spacing between the port flare and the ribbon.

C

[john trials]

Curt, thanks for the quick response.

Unfortunately, I cut the port holes this past weekend. Then yesterday I thought about the proximity of the port and tweeter (too late!).

I haven't cut the port tubes yet. When I do, I'll install the ports and see how much the tweeter blocks the port. I haven't glued the baffle on yet, so I'll be able to mock this up and still see inside the upper area of the enclosure. If I can get a good photo, I'll post it.

I doubt it's worth filling my port holes so I could move them to the side a few inches, but every rule of thumb I've read about porting says to keep the port clear at least the diameter of the port tube (I have to look at the Loudspeaker Cookbook and see if any tests were done). I would think the flare helps flow a bit in the Monitors. At the low sound levels I usually listen, the 'plug' of air oscillating in the port will probably have such a low amplitude that it won't make a difference.

My plan is to use these for surrounds, and I have a sub, so any improvement down around 35Hz won't matter much for me (unless I use these for a 2-channel arrangement some day, which is a possiblity...that's part of the reason I'm building the switchable crossover). Also, if this could help other builders to improve the porting, that'd be great.

Again, I've heard Beerparty's Statement Monitors, and the sound is superb. I doubt shifting the port a bit would improve things to where I would even notice.

[Curt C]

The airmass will likely turn from a plug into a mushroom at the flare, so much of the airflow will be slowed and turned from the port tube axis. Assuming the flare diameter is 4" and the distance to the front wall is only an inch (worst case) the open area at the edge of the flare is around 12.5"^2, where the port area itself is only 3"^2.

C

[john trials]

I cut my port tubes (3" long tube, 8" overall length with the flares attached) and assembled a port. After installing it in a Monitor enclosure (without a baffle attached), I used a bunch of business cards and some thin MDF pieces to position the Fountek tweeter to within 0.010" of where it will be in the final assembly.

There is PLENTY of room around the port. Just going by the measurement of 1.13" doesn't work. The area/volume around the port is very open. The tweeter isn't very wide (compared to the flare), and it's not lined up directly in the way of the port (it's a little lower in the cabinet...closer to the mid tunnel). I guess it's not optimum, according to what I've read about port clearances, but it's fine for me (because I don't want to fill/move the port hole)

So...if you're REALLY picky (and I'm not saying this in a bad way...I'm usually very picky), the port can be moved. Based on this quick set up, I'm leaving mine where Jim's dimensions place it. It should be fine. If I hadn't already cut the port hole, I would cut mine a few inches to either side to optimize the port.



Edit: No progress on the build, but just a thought...as a test, when the enclosures are finished, the port can be mounted outside of the cabinet to see if there is any airflow restriction caused by the tweeter (wouldn't that look nice!). There would be a slight increase to the enclosure volume (which would lower the Qtc, so that might offset the extra output of an unrestricted port). The enclosure volume can be kept the same by placing a 'dummy volume' equal to the port volume in the cabinet.

.

[john trials]

I got out and did some fiberglass work today. Fun stuff (NOT!). Then I installed all of the crossovers after a thorough check to make sure they are correctly wired. This afternoon I glued the 1/2" baffle onto the CC. Tomorrow I'll do the Monitor baffles.





A lot has happened in the last few days. I got laid off on Friday due to lack of money and work at my company. Fortunately, I machined my switch plates a few weeks ago. I'd be pretty disappointed if I hadn't made these switch plates. I will no longer have access to a milling machine, which has me really sad (sadder than losing the job...I feel really free right now. Truly enjoying life!).



Get the symbols?...near and far.

[john trials]

The 1/2" baffles are glued to the cabinets and this morning I flush trimmed the outer edges and the tunnel. Later I'll glue the 3/4" baffle, trim it, then chamfer the edges, and sand the chamfer into a roundover.

The 1/2" baffles were made from scrap MDF, glued together to make larger boards. I'm amazed at how tough the joint is where 2 boards are glued end to end. All of the joints will be hidden underneath the 3/4" baffle anyway.

The stains on the baffles are from Seal Coat, used to seal the inside of the cabinets.

[exojam]

John,

Very sorry to hear about the job lose. It seems you are taking it as good as possible. I hope something comes your way when you start looking.

James

[john trials]

I was laid off 7 years ago also, and learned that there is MUCH more to life than a job, so I try not to let my job rule my life (I feel a job gets in the way of life!). Luckily, my wife and I are good at stretching a dollar (having done this unemployment thing in the past...at least this time she's part-time employed...last time we both didn't have jobs), and I've been saving for a while. I thought I'd get the boot last year, so I lasted longer than I expected.

Unfortunately, this means I'll still be staring at a tube TV when I get this 5.1 sound system done.

I love being outdoors, so being laid off in August is like a gift. Last time I was laid off in Nov...a bit too cold, but I still made the best of it. The hard part is all my friends work, so I have no one to play with during the daytime.

Back to speakers: The 3/4" baffles are all glued on. Now I have to flush-trim them, and start planning for the grills.

[john trials]

Trimmed the 3/4" baffles. Chamfered the vertical edges. Tomorrow I'll use a sanding board and roundover the edges.

[Thea-masta]

Good job on the build! They look great!
The picture with you and your daughter sat back enjoying your work with that tinyy tube TV in the middle is priceless...

[john trials]

I've got to be the slowest speaker builder ever! The weather outside has been so nice that I haven't been down in the basement lately (on sunny days, I spend as much time outside as I can).

I finally got around to making some grills out of 1/2" thick MDF, which are now wearing 2 coats of Seal Coat (I have it laying around, and I want to use it up, but I prefer the glue/water mixture). The fronts have magnets and rears will have ball and socket mounts. I will spray them with flat black (BBQ black) on the next sunny day (we've got a few days of rain coming...rare). Then fabric.



I also rounded the baffle edges with a sanding board, epoxied some magnets in the baffles, then gave them a coating of 1:1 wood glue:water. A second coat of the glue mixture and these will be done. I'm not going to veneer them for a while (gotta save $ until I find a job). I like the look of the MDF covered with glue, anyway. It makes a nice hard shell.

[john trials]

Done for now! I hooked these up to an ancient receiver and let 'em rip. No surprises. I've already heard BeerParty's Statement Monitors, so I know they sound just as nice as the full-sized ones. I can hardly wait to hear all 5 Statements plus my Monster Sonosub all together.



I just have to finish the grills (no rush), get a DVD player, connect the Monitors, CC and Sonosub up to my AV receiver, and enjoy.

I've never seen the rear of a CC, but here's mine with a warning: be careful where you position the binding posts. Mine seemed fine, until it was time to assemble the whole thing. The crossover got in the way of my access to the binding posts inside the cabinet, so I did some last minute plugging of the old holes with 1/4" dowels and drilled some new holes to relocate the binding posts. That was much easier than removing the crossover to get to the binding posts (the horizontal brace really gets in the way...I probably should have planned the crossover position better, but I'll probably never have to remove it anyway).

[Jim Holtz]

They look great John!

PS: Put some 1" flat foam in the mid tunnels. :W

Jim

[richnen]

Looks great John.

Love to hear how good the Monitors sound, can't wait till I finish mine. Wish I had the room to build the whole package!

Regarding your Winner of the ugliest Statement crossovers post, ummm ya I think I took the crown. After seeing what you consider ugly there is no way i am posting a picture of mine! Geeze, out comes the soldering gun.. need to take mine apart and fix em up. Not going to be too hard on myself having never done it before but after seeing yours and the others mine looks like a failed high school shop class project!

[john trials]

They look great John!

PS: Put some 1" flat foam in the mid tunnels. :W

Jim

I may or may not put foam in the tunnels. I still have each of my full Statements with only one tunnel foamed, one no foam and I really like the sound...I'm amazed at how much the foam reduces (almost eliminates) the sound coming from the tunnels. Since these Monitors are going to be surrounds, I left the tunnels with no foam (I can always add it later and play around with the 'tuning'). Also, I made the switchable crossovers, because I'm not sure about the placement yet.

[john trials]

Looks great John.

Love to hear how good the Monitors sound, can't wait till I finish mine. Wish I had the room to build the whole package!

Regarding your Winner of the ugliest Statement crossovers post, ummm ya I think I took the crown. After seeing what you consider ugly there is no way i am posting a picture of mine! Geeze, out comes the soldering gun.. need to take mine apart and fix em up. Not going to be too hard on myself having never done it before but after seeing yours and the others mine looks like a failed high school shop class project!

My room is pretty small. This 5.1 system is going to be very dominant in the room. It'll be interesting how it all turns out when finished. I went a bit overboard with this!

[john trials]

PROBLEM: I used these Monitors in place of my Tritrix TLs to watch 'The Dark Knight' last night. A simple stereo hooked up to a DVD player (I run the speakers full range, no high pass). In quite a few places in the movie, the left woofer was making a crackling sound. Everyone in my family could hear it...it was not subtle. We were not listening at loud levels, either. Fortunately, the offending noise is very prominent (and fortunately for my testing purposes, it's reproducible) during the closing credits.

I swapped the right and left speakers, and the noise went along with the speaker, so it's not a connector problem or something wrong with the source/receiver. I'll do some testing today to see what's up.

My thoughts are:

1) swap the woofers and see if it's the driver,
2) if it's not the driver, then inspect the crossover,
3) air leak?
4) just because I'm curious, I may run some test tones to see if I can reproduce the noise at certain frequencies.

If you guys have any other ideas, I'd appreciate some tips. I was surprised by this noise, because prior to the movie, I played some live music and everything sounded great. There was some potent kick drum in the live music, but not the low bass that is in the movie.

[john trials]

PROBLEM SOLVED: I swapped the woofers, and the offending noise went with the woofer...so I've got a bad RS180. I ran some test tones, and the noise would occur in all frequencies that the woofer handled. Extremely easy to reproduce (I really hate intermittent problems, so this one was kind of nice).

I just checked the Parts Express website, and the RS180-4 is out of stock until Nov 24!!!!!!!!!! Rats!!!!!!!!