Modula mtm’s

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  • Aceman
    Junior Member
    • Aug 2020
    • 5

    Modula mtm’s

    Hey everyone, I just came across this site and I was looking into building a set of modules for my HT. How would these preform as mains and are there any updated plans for these speakers ?
  • Bear
    Super Senior Member
    • Dec 2008
    • 1038

    #2
    JonMarsh and his EvilTwin are very well-respected designers. However, parts availability may be an issue -- drivers come and go out of production, and specifications drift over time. Since Parts Express has almost completely exited the pre-finished cabinet business, there is less of an incentive to go with the Modula-series of designs, but they are still well-respected designs. If you look at the NatalieP (aka NatP) design, you will find a lot of people who built them and who are tremendously happy with them.

    I will offer this piece of advice: for a standard-sized room with standard-sized seating distances and reasonable volume expectations and one or more subwoofers, then a MTM or 6+1 TM type of design will satisfy the vast majority of HT-oriented listeners. For example, with a 100Hz crossover to one or more subs, many decent MTM designs have enough piston volume to get to near-enough reference levels at 10 - 12' seating distance. The key is getting there cleanly, and that's where Jon's designs tend to excel.
    Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.

    Comment

    • Steve Manning
      Moderator
      • Dec 2006
      • 1879

      #3
      Aceman, as far as the Modula MTM, the tweeter is still being made, so this build is still an option. As far as the NatP version of it, they tweeter is no longer in production. I built a set of the Modula MTM's, https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...ht=magico+mini and can certainly recommend them.

      As Bear suggested, add a sub or two and you will be very happy.
      Last edited by theSven; 09 April 2023, 12:54 Sunday. Reason: Update image location
      Hold on to your butts - It's about to get Musical!



      WEBSITE: http://www.smjaudio.com/

      Comment

      • Aceman
        Junior Member
        • Aug 2020
        • 5

        #4
        Wow those are incredible, and thanks for the response. Will the new versions of the drivers still be ok to use with these xovers ? Also I plan on making the box myself anyways as I get the mdf for free and shipping to Canada is very $$$. I would like to do the TM version after as my surrounds.

        Comment

        • Aceman
          Junior Member
          • Aug 2020
          • 5

          #5
          Originally posted by Bear
          JonMarsh and his EvilTwin are very well-respected designers. However, parts availability may be an issue -- drivers come and go out of production, and specifications drift over time. Since Parts Express has almost completely exited the pre-finished cabinet business, there is less of an incentive to go with the Modula-series of designs, but they are still well-respected designs. If you look at the NatalieP (aka NatP) design, you will find a lot of people who built them and who are tremendously happy with them.











          I will offer this piece of advice: for a standard-sized room with standard-sized seating distances and reasonable volume expectations and one or more subwoofers, then a MTM or 6+1 TM type of design will satisfy the vast majority of HT-oriented listeners. For example, with a 100Hz crossover to one or more subs, many decent MTM designs have enough piston volume to get to near-enough reference levels at 10 - 12' seating distance. The key is getting there cleanly, and that's where Jon's designs tend to excel.
          What would you suggest for a tm them? I’m not looking for a kit I have to buy because that gets very pricey getting them shipped to Canada

          Comment

          • Bear
            Super Senior Member
            • Dec 2008
            • 1038

            #6
            Originally posted by Aceman
            What would you suggest for a tm them? I’m not looking for a kit I have to buy because that gets very pricey getting them shipped to Canada
            I used MarkK's ER18DXT for years as my surround speakers. In almost all respects, they were as good as the ScanSpeak MTMs that I had for LCR. Mark is pursuing other hobbies, but someone archived his website (and the design):

            Visual blog of DIY two way loudspeaker build based on Mark K design using SEAS ER18RNX (H1456) 7" woofer and SEAS 27TBCD/GB-DXT (H1499) tweeter


            The drivers have drifted upwards in price, so it is no longer at a real sweet spot in the market. In that vein, my next design is going to be a 6+1 using the SB Acoustics SB17NBAC with a SB26ADC mounted in a waveguide. With an 80Hz XO to a sub, it should be able to do 105dB-ish as a transient with the power from my receiver (~100W). This is a pretty popular combination, so I'm not clearing any new paths. In fact, if you can deal with the stepped baffle, Troels Gravesen has a kit for it here (yeah, no kits...):



            The NAC and NBAC are basically identical except for the "black" (really dark gray) anodizing treatment.

            JonMarsh also had a waveguide TM design in the Modula series (Moddula XT was the ultimate version), though the mounting of the tweeter in the waveguide may be a bit involved for a first (or fifth) project. Zaph (aka John Krutke) has the SR71 design that was targeted at a sweet spot in the market. I don't have a clue about driver availability. He also did a high-end two-way (ZRT; with a larger cabinet than I would have wanted) using the ScanSpeak 18W/8531G and the ScanSpeak D3004/6600 Air Circ tweeter.



            Jeff Bagby (recently deceased) had a number of designs, though I think almost all of them are sold as kits. I am doing one of his higher-end designs now, which happened to also be documented enough for me to fill in the gaps (and make some changes). I'm also doing the crossover on my own, so that can help constrain costs (somewhat). And the list goes on and on from here.

            The real question is your budget and building capabilities. And on the budget front, do note that there are a number of tools that one also needs to make a high performing speaker (e.g., circle jigs help a lot, but you can make your own). I think someone offered up the idea once to take what you think is your budget and double it, but I wouldn't admit to this short of a court order.
            Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.

            Comment

            • Steve Manning
              Moderator
              • Dec 2006
              • 1879

              #7
              Originally posted by Bear
              I used MarkK's ER18DXT for years as my surround speakers. In almost all respects, they were as good as the ScanSpeak MTMs that I had for LCR. Mark is pursuing other hobbies, but someone archived his website (and the design):

              Visual blog of DIY two way loudspeaker build based on Mark K design using SEAS ER18RNX (H1456) 7" woofer and SEAS 27TBCD/GB-DXT (H1499) tweeter


              The drivers have drifted upwards in price, so it is no longer at a real sweet spot in the market. In that vein, my next design is going to be a 6+1 using the SB Acoustics SB17NBAC with a SB26ADC mounted in a waveguide. With an 80Hz XO to a sub, it should be able to do 105dB-ish as a transient with the power from my receiver (~100W). This is a pretty popular combination, so I'm not clearing any new paths. In fact, if you can deal with the stepped baffle, Troels Gravesen has a kit for it here (yeah, no kits...):



              The NAC and NBAC are basically identical except for the "black" (really dark gray) anodizing treatment.

              JonMarsh also had a waveguide TM design in the Modula series (Moddula XT was the ultimate version), though the mounting of the tweeter in the waveguide may be a bit involved for a first (or fifth) project. Zaph (aka John Krutke) has the SR71 design that was targeted at a sweet spot in the market. I don't have a clue about driver availability. He also did a high-end two-way (ZRT; with a larger cabinet than I would have wanted) using the ScanSpeak 18W/8531G and the ScanSpeak D3004/6600 Air Circ tweeter.



              Jeff Bagby (recently deceased) had a number of designs, though I think almost all of them are sold as kits. I am doing one of his higher-end designs now, which happened to also be documented enough for me to fill in the gaps (and make some changes). I'm also doing the crossover on my own, so that can help constrain costs (somewhat). And the list goes on and on from here.

              The real question is your budget and building capabilities. And on the budget front, do note that there are a number of tools that one also needs to make a high performing speaker (e.g., circle jigs help a lot, but you can make your own). I think someone offered up the idea once to take what you think is your budget and double it, but I wouldn't admit to this short of a court order.


              So very true on the tool budget, you always need something. :W
              Hold on to your butts - It's about to get Musical!



              WEBSITE: http://www.smjaudio.com/

              Comment

              • Aceman
                Junior Member
                • Aug 2020
                • 5

                #8
                Originally posted by Bear
                I used MarkK's ER18DXT for years as my surround speakers. In almost all respects, they were as good as the ScanSpeak MTMs that I had for LCR. Mark is pursuing other hobbies, but someone archived his website (and the design):

                Visual blog of DIY two way loudspeaker build based on Mark K design using SEAS ER18RNX (H1456) 7" woofer and SEAS 27TBCD/GB-DXT (H1499) tweeter


                The drivers have drifted upwards in price, so it is no longer at a real sweet spot in the market. In that vein, my next design is going to be a 6+1 using the SB Acoustics SB17NBAC with a SB26ADC mounted in a waveguide. With an 80Hz XO to a sub, it should be able to do 105dB-ish as a transient with the power from my receiver (~100W). This is a pretty popular combination, so I'm not clearing any new paths. In fact, if you can deal with the stepped baffle, Troels Gravesen has a kit for it here (yeah, no kits...):



                The NAC and NBAC are basically identical except for the "black" (really dark gray) anodizing treatment.

                JonMarsh also had a waveguide TM design in the Modula series (Moddula XT was the ultimate version), though the mounting of the tweeter in the waveguide may be a bit involved for a first (or fifth) project. Zaph (aka John Krutke) has the SR71 design that was targeted at a sweet spot in the market. I don't have a clue about driver availability. He also did a high-end two-way (ZRT; with a larger cabinet than I would have wanted) using the ScanSpeak 18W/8531G and the ScanSpeak D3004/6600 Air Circ tweeter.



                Jeff Bagby (recently deceased) had a number of designs, though I think almost all of them are sold as kits. I am doing one of his higher-end designs now, which happened to also be documented enough for me to fill in the gaps (and make some changes). I'm also doing the crossover on my own, so that can help constrain costs (somewhat). And the list goes on and on from here.

                The real question is your budget and building capabilities. And on the budget front, do note that there are a number of tools that one also needs to make a high performing speaker (e.g., circle jigs help a lot, but you can make your own). I think someone offered up the idea once to take what you think is your budget and double it, but I wouldn't admit to this short of a court order.
                I don’t really have a budget in mind but I’d say around the $500 mark. I looked at the zr71 and it looks nice. I see I can get the drivers for around 140cn. I was also looking at the modula tm version. What are your thoughts on one ? Thanks

                Comment

                • Bear
                  Super Senior Member
                  • Dec 2008
                  • 1038

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Aceman
                  I don’t really have a budget in mind but I’d say around the $500 mark. I looked at the zr71 and it looks nice. I see I can get the drivers for around 140cn. I was also looking at the modula tm version. What are your thoughts on one ? Thanks
                  Aside from the ER18DXT design, I have no first-hand experience with any of them. I will offer that Zaph was also incredibly well respected and definitely had a reputation for high value designs. Jon tends to be more performance oriented, but the Modula series and NatPs are also high value. More or less, you probably won't go wrong with any of these.

                  I would also be remiss if I didn't mention the Curt/Jim super duo, as well. They have fully-documented designs and kits.
                  Speaker Design Works is the best place for audiophile home speakers for DIY. Our bookshelf speakers and tower speakers are fully documented with clear instructions for the audio enthusiast. Build your own hi-end stereo speakers for music and Home Theater.
                  Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.

                  Comment

                  • wolf_teeth
                    Senior Member
                    • Feb 2011
                    • 164

                    #10
                    Aceman- I see you found your way over here to pursue the Modula trajectory. Bear has given you some very good advice.

                    Later,
                    Wolf

                    Comment

                    • Aceman
                      Junior Member
                      • Aug 2020
                      • 5

                      #11
                      Originally posted by wolf_teeth
                      Aceman- I see you found your way over here to pursue the Modula trajectory. Bear has given you some very good advice.

                      Later,
                      Wolf
                      Hahaha ya, I still don’t know what to go with. Too many options haha

                      Comment

                      • Bear
                        Super Senior Member
                        • Dec 2008
                        • 1038

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Aceman
                        Hahaha ya, I still don’t know what to go with. Too many options haha
                        Once you start building speakers, you generally build more. Think of these as a starter package, not your final product. A stereo pair can start as your LR main speakers, and then migrate to the Surrounds and Rears as you upgrade. Given your budget (and potential lack of tools like roundover bits and Jasper Jigs), I'd recommend looking at the ZaphAudio 5.2 MTM package from Madisound. It's about at your budget, and in a sealed cabinet (aim for about 10 liters), it can provide plenty of SPL capability down to about 100Hz.

                        After you get these built, you will want a subwoofer, and then you should go after a center channel (assuming you are looking at a full 5.1 or 5.2 replacement). For HT, the Center Channel is actually the most important (core dialog).

                        One final thought: I personally don't subscribe to the notion of having all 5 channels (or 7!!) be identical. There is a school of thought that thinks that all channels should be identical or at least substantially similar. YMMV.
                        Welcome to Rivendell, Mr. Anderson.

                        Comment

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