Full Theater Build and Sub Box Help needed

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  • Landspeeder
    Senior Member
    • Feb 2008
    • 273

    Full Theater Build and Sub Box Help needed

    Hello everyone...

    I am buying Jed's Dynamic 4T and 4CC to be finished late December/early January.

    I am looking to build a center channel stand/subwoofer enclosure to use with this.

    I will be powering the speakers with an emotiva xpa-5.

    I bought an elemental designs LT/550 b-stock plate amp for a steal a few months ago when ED was unloading them/stopping production.

    Amplifier Specifications:

    Power Rating : 550W RMS @ 4Ω
    Overall Height : 10.000"
    Overall Width : 10.000"
    Mounting Height : 8.750"
    Mounting Width : 8.750"
    Power Cable : Detachable

    Detailed Amplifier Specifications:

    Signal to Noise Ratio : >90dBAdBA
    Variable Input Sensitivity : Yes
    Variable Low Pass X-Over : 50-100Hz
    Current & Thermal Protection : No
    Variable Phase Control : Yes
    Warranty : 1 Year

    My max dimensions are 3'7.5" wide, 1'6" deep, 1'3" tall... and this must be pushed up against the wall. The box will be made with doubled up 3/4 MDF and will be chocked full of internal bracing.

    Jed's speakers play down to 43 Hz... do I'll need help
    1) selecting 2 subs
    2) tuning a box to match these two subs using the outer dimensions mentioned above (though I can build a smaller 'inner box'... square port or sealed is fine. Choosing a tuning frequency... is 10 Hz out of the question?
    3) selecting the cuttoff frequency to use (100 Hz - 60 Hz)

    I am looking for clean tight base. We recently moved into our own home... and this is going into a very small theater/office. We'll be here for 2.5 more years as we build our new home... then this will go into a purpose built theater.

    Images not available

    These pictures show the concept's I am looking at implementing. Currently the sub box is 'bowed out' in the middle... but I believe that I may leave the front 'flat' to quicken the build time.

    As you can hopefully see the back of the sub box needs to be recessed (and the bottom notched out) so that the amp/wiring has some breathing room when this is pushed tight against the wall.

    Thanks for the help!
    Last edited by theSven; 18 August 2023, 15:22 Friday. Reason: Remove broken link
    My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731
  • Landspeeder
    Senior Member
    • Feb 2008
    • 273

    #2
    Here are the 2 I am strongly considering...
    Dayton RSS315HF-8 12" Reference HF Subwoofer 8 Ohm wired to a 4 Ohm load
    $140 http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=295-444

    Dayton TIT320C-4 12" Titanic Mk III Subwoofer 4 Ohm wired to a 8 Ohm load
    $150 http://www.parts-express.com/pe/show...number=295-404

    Any other suggestions?
    My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

    Comment

    • Landspeeder
      Senior Member
      • Feb 2008
      • 273

      #3
      I'll be using two Seas L26ROY 10" 4 ohm woofers mated to the (550 watt at 4 Ohm) plate amp.

      I'll wire the 2 woofers in series to hit an 8 ohm load. The output on the amp should then be (550 * 4 / 8)=275 watts constant which should match up nicely with 2 woofers.

      This should help to pare down the box build and decisions tremendously.

      Nominal Impedance 4 Ohms
      Voice Coil Resistance 3.1 Ohms
      Recommended Frequency Range 20 - 1000 Hz
      Voice Coil Inductance 0.53 mH
      Short Term Power Handling * 500 W
      Force Factor 12 N/A
      Long Term Power Handling * 250 W
      Free Air Resonance 22 Hz
      Characteristic Sensitivity (2,83V, 1m) 88.0 dB
      Moving Mass 107 g
      Voice Coil Diameter 56 mm
      Air Load Mass In IEC Baffl e 4.0 g
      Voice Coil Height 38 mm
      Suspension Compliance 0.5 mm/N
      Air Gap Height 10 mm
      Suspension Mechanical Resistance 3.7 Ns/m
      Linear Coil Travel (p-p) 28 mm
      Effective Piston Area 363 cm2
      Maximum Coil Travel (p-p) 56 mm
      VAS 87 Litres
      Magnetic Gap Flux Density 1.2 T
      QMS 4.14
      Magnet Weight 2.34 kg
      QES 0.33
      Total Weight 10 kg
      QTS 0.31
      My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

      Comment

      • Landspeeder
        Senior Member
        • Feb 2008
        • 273

        #4
        Please yell at me if I am wrong... And what choice would everyone recommend?

        2 individual round ported enclosures tuned to 25 Hz, the flared tube up front with the woofer.

        1 shared enclosure tuned to 22 Hz with a single forward slotted port on the bottom lined up between the two woofers.


        I believe a box that is 13 H x 30 W x 15.5 D with a bottom slotted vent 2 H x 12 W x 63 L will give me the 22 Hz tuned to a single shared box of 3.5 ft^3. Does this look like a good match for these speakers? I am thinking a crossover range of 60 Hz will likely work well with the Dynamic 4T's.
        My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

        Comment

        • Jed
          Ultra Senior Member
          • Apr 2005
          • 3617

          #5
          Originally posted by Landspeeder
          Please yell at me if I am wrong... And what choice would everyone recommend?

          2 individual round ported enclosures tuned to 25 Hz, the flared tube up front with the woofer.

          1 shared enclosure tuned to 22 Hz with a single forward slotted port on the bottom lined up between the two woofers.


          I believe a box that is 13 H x 30 W x 15.5 D with a bottom slotted vent 2 H x 12 W x 63 L will give me the 22 Hz tuned to a single shared box of 3.5 ft^3. Does this look like a good match for these speakers? I am thinking a crossover range of 60 Hz will likely work well with the Dynamic 4T's.
          I'd go sealed with the 4Ts and cross around 60-70hz. The L26Roy will work well in a small ported box tuned low with a slot port to lower port noise.

          Comment

          • audioslave
            Member
            • Oct 2003
            • 34

            #6
            2x10 or go with 2 x12?

            I'm curious about the driver selection....its a nice driver but kinda $$. For that money you could buy:



            Not sure how they compare in distortion....but you would have 30% (sd vs effective piston area?) per driver. Probably overkill for your current location. But you mentioned moving it to a dedicated larger home theater in the future. Of course I haven't modeled them but its worth a look.

            John at AE is great to work with and builds great drivers. I have an older AV12 that sounds great.
            mike

            Comment

            • Landspeeder
              Senior Member
              • Feb 2008
              • 273

              #7
              I am receiving a very good deal on the seas woofers from a fellow board member

              Though I thank you for the other recommended driver
              My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

              Comment

              • Landspeeder
                Senior Member
                • Feb 2008
                • 273

                #8
                Time for an update. Work exploded in early December and has just recently begun to calm down. That means I now have some progress to show... and I am only 1 or 2 weekends away from listening impressions:

                The torsion box shelves

                Images not available

                The zero clearance rack:

                Image not available

                The distressed Mahogany speakers:
                These are HARD to get a good shot of. I hired a photographer this last weekend and he laughed at me when I brought him to the speaker... he refused to take any pictures so I did the best I could. They have 3 coats of sealer, 4 coats of pore filler, and 15 coats of high gloss poly. They change colors as you walk past them

                Images not available

                One thing I'd like to not on the binding post area. You'll see the 'seam' through the clear coat, however no physical seam exists.
                Last edited by theSven; 18 August 2023, 15:20 Friday. Reason: Remove broken image links
                My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

                Comment

                • Jed
                  Ultra Senior Member
                  • Apr 2005
                  • 3617

                  #9
                  Glad you are back at it again Landspeeder. I had to do a tweak for your near wall placement to adjust the BSC in the crossover... but if you need a little more BSC just let me know. Though, I think I managed to get a good response for your specific setup.

                  Jed

                  Comment

                  • Landspeeder
                    Senior Member
                    • Feb 2008
                    • 273

                    #10
                    Jed,

                    I am rather stoked about listening to these beasts... 2 more afternoons and I'll be ready to. I'm hoping for the end of this weekend, but it may not be until the following.

                    For now they are likely to placed in one of the worst listening environments possible, at least the room isn't square

                    I'll let you know if they need a little more tweaking.

                    Thanks again for all of the help! I'll post finished pictures both here and on your forum along with Listening impressions once all has set it
                    My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

                    Comment

                    • Landspeeder
                      Senior Member
                      • Feb 2008
                      • 273

                      #11
                      I'll have a listening impressions up before long.

                      For now, here is my progress in my temporary 11' wide, 9' deep, 10.5' tall theater/office.

                      Image not available

                      Here is the first 1/2 way good shot I have been able to get on the finish!

                      Image not available

                      This one also kind-of shows the finish. If I get off to the side a little bit all that shows is a deep red in the camera (and a bit in real-life too). If I get a little more to the side all that shows is a mirror-like reflection.

                      Image not available

                      Keep in mind this is a 42" moniter

                      Image not available

                      The soon to be finished center channel stand: a dual seas sub enclousre

                      Image not available
                      Last edited by theSven; 18 August 2023, 15:21 Friday. Reason: Remove broken image link
                      My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

                      Comment

                      • Landspeeder
                        Senior Member
                        • Feb 2008
                        • 273

                        #12
                        I am disgusted, disappointed, dismayed, and in tears. To have believed that I knew what good music sounds like based on listening rooms featuring Margin Logan speakers and B&W's flagships hooked up to Onkyo gear: it has all been a lie!

                        The waves thrumming through these beasts is a reflection of the artists soul where the recording is of a grade of quality. Listening to Emilie Autumn's laced I can hear more than I ever have in a live screening. It is as if I am sitting on stage as venomous flavours coil about my very being. Her voice within Opheliac can displays spittle hitting the microphone: what was once thought to be synthesize background base is in fact a cello hitting on some of the quickest beats I have ever beheld upon the instrument of the deep.

                        Turning to James blunt, I close my eyes and hear him singing with me. The illusion is so real I half expect him to ask for a taste of the warm Dark Lord within my hands. These sublime notes are unlocking a deep-rooted resonance, a most truly distinct vibration, and my vision closed to the world secretly sustains the fiction as for once I touch the soul and the feeling of intention without the author present.

                        Moving on towards Gorillaz I begin to laugh: the electro-smash together is gone and in its place one can hear distinct notes from recognizable instruments. Turning to the Scorpions I invite my father into the room. His jaw drops and he says not a word for Eye to Eye... I see the corners of his eyes turn wet as the desire for reflection impacts his soul. This is but the third time in my life I have seen his eyes tear up, the other was upon the stand of my marriage, the other at the death of his father.

                        I also feel saddened as much music that I once enjoyed cannot be listened to on these works of art. Poorly recorded albums sound harsh, these speakers are not forgiving. Jet is no more. The 'music' my love enjoys falls into this category so I strike this as a double win, for enjoy most of it I do not: however I have given her an independent listening room in trade.

                        Where I wept for the music, movies are truly remarkable. In nearly every system I have ever heard the voice is drowned out by overdone sound effects and music tracks. Here the voicing is clear and distinct: the balance struck is flawless. Sin City is a work to marvel upon.

                        At no point can I distinctly point to a certain sound, other to say that general direction, or the other general direction. The transaction is seamless. This is all from a VERY poorly laid out room. 11 feet wide, 10.5 feet tall, and 9 feet deep. I sit dead center from the speakers not even 5 feet away, yet I weep in joy and in sorrow. Joy for being able to feel the soul of another and pain from the loss of poorly recorded albums.

                        To Jed, I give you my greatest thanks. You have helped lead me to a path of audio Nirvana. Words do not give justice to what you have offered us mere mortals. You have given us the art of fire where before only the most elite had but a glimmer of a chance to feel warmth. Your art is no less than that which now rips through it at my heart, soul, and mind.
                        My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

                        Comment

                        • Jed
                          Ultra Senior Member
                          • Apr 2005
                          • 3617

                          #13
                          I'll admit I was a little worried after reading the first sentence. I'm glad the review got better from there!

                          Honestly, great build and I'm so glad you are liking them. They look fantastic!

                          Jed

                          Comment

                          • Johnloudb
                            Super Senior Member
                            • May 2007
                            • 1877

                            #14
                            Hi Landspeeder,

                            That's some review. That first sentence had me concerned to - first thought was that your place burned down.

                            Glad you like your new speaker, I've had a similar experience with my Lineup R44 which also use the Tangeband mid. They really pull a disapearing act with the right material, and bad recordings are bad. I've found tone controls helpful in that regard. It won't save the recording but will make some stuff easier to listen to.
                            John unk:

                            "Why can't we all just, get along?" ~ Jack Nicholson (Mars Attacks)

                            My Website (hyperacusis, tinnitus, my story)

                            Comment

                            • Nathan P
                              Senior Member
                              • Mar 2006
                              • 226

                              #15
                              Nice review and beautiful job. I too have noticed that the better my sytem sounds with good material, the worse it exposes the problems in poor recordings. Vocals sound harsh, guitars sound dead and the "fuzz" of clipping becomes overwhelmingly apparent. I feel it's worth it for the wonder I feel when a good recording touches my soul.

                              Comment

                              • Landspeeder
                                Senior Member
                                • Feb 2008
                                • 273

                                #16
                                O dear Jon, after the garage and curved cabinets burning down... I think I would just loose it if the home wen too!

                                It really is a compromise I am willing to deal with: well produced art can sound wonderful... and I can use my wife's 'system' for the less than quality caliber recordings
                                My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

                                Comment

                                • numberoneoppa
                                  Senior Member
                                  • Sep 2009
                                  • 535

                                  #17
                                  Jed, you should seriously make that review your new homepage. =)
                                  -Josh

                                  That feeling when things are finally going right. Yeah, that one.

                                  Comment

                                  • Landspeeder
                                    Senior Member
                                    • Feb 2008
                                    • 273

                                    #18
                                    apparently it is possible to blush online.
                                    My Builds: https://www.htguide.com/forum/showth...731#post593731

                                    Comment

                                    • knguyen429
                                      Member
                                      • Feb 2010
                                      • 37

                                      #19
                                      That first sentence really had everyone going. I too thought something bad had happened. Great review and what a beautiful finish on those speakers.
                                      - Kenneth Nguyen

                                      Comment

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