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  • Canon DILA for $4K

    The Canon LCOS (which actually uses JVC's DILA panels) has been announced in the U.S.

    This is a really good deal. SXGA+ (1400x1050), 1000:1, 2500 lumens!, lens is about a 1.2-1.8 (a very versatile throw range). All for $4000. For comparison, these specs are pretty close the SX21 except this thing is almost twice as bright, is HDCP compliant, and is half the size and half or less the price. Oh, and it's supposedly pretty quiet. Contrast is not world class, but if that's not your highest priority, this thing is great in every other respect.

    Have to wait until a tweaker or Mr. Phelps gets his hands on one to see what it really will do, but it looks like a pretty good candidate if you've always lusted after DILA, brightness and low price all in one package (me!).


  • #2
    As I've said elsewhere, I'd love to have one of these for my presentation projector. It would be a very nice kick up from XGA... and the color fidelity would be worlds better than the DLP presentation projectors! Price is pretty dang reasonable... but it's not quite an impulse purchase!!

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    • #3
      Whoa... is that right? Unless there's some downsides that I don't know about (I don't know as many small details about DILA as I do LCD and DLP) this looks like a PJ killer right now. Almost 1080p capability!

      Well, we're safe for now. Thank goodness we're in a bowling alley.
      - Pleasantville


      • #4
        There are purchases that are non-impulse?

        I've really got to restrain myself. I want to go to a bigger 2.35 AR screen, but my present PJ would require a scaler to do so and the SDE and resolution are not up to the task. I was going to wait a year or so until JVC had something priced to allow me to do it. Now this comes along and I COULD do it now for half what I was thinking. and probably double the brightness of anything coming down the road from JVC this year. CRAP!



        • #5
          Is DILA and LCOS the same thing?

          I saw a system with a JVC DILA in it once and man it was amazing. If I ever won the lottery that's probably what I would put in my dedicated theater room (unless I go CRT). Maybe now with this Canon we'll start to see the prices come down to something resembling reasonable.


          • #6
            Kevin, as far as I know LCOS and D-ILA are the same technology. If I recall correctly, it was Sony who started using the LCOS handle. Jon or Brandon probably can correct me on this if I am wrong.
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            • #7
              You are correct. D-ILA is JVC's brand name for LCOS. Hitachi or someone else, not Sony, popularized the generic term LCOS. Sony came up with the mellifluous term Silicon Xtal(Crystal) Reflective Display.

              Not all LCOS are created equal. Sony's (SXRD) and JVC's (DILA) use a non-organic vertically aligned LC layer which is not subject to deterioration in the much discussed TI sponsored study of how LCD rots before your very eyes. The lone LCOS unit in that study which TI failed to identify by name was in fact a Hitachi unit, which uses an organic variant subject to longterm degradation like HTPS LCD.

              Basically, LCOS is a LCD material on top of a mirror-like silicon base, where all the controlling circuitry for the pixels is behind the "mirror" part, so the fill factor is exceedingly high. An interesting result of this architecture is that the control voltages for each pixel may "bleed" a bit past the pixel boundary sort of blending them slightly and increasing the apparent smoothness.

              Some newer developments - older DILA, and SXRD (I think) need a somewhat high (relatively) voltage to maintain them in their state, which made the demands on the supporting circuitry a little greater and limited their refresh speed. Some new developments have made some of this backplane circuitry PWM controlled, enabling lower control voltages as well as cheaper smaller circuitry. JVCs new RPTVs use this type of DILA, and they supposedly being mfged in cooperation with another company, UMC, rather than strictly by JVC themselves.

              Anyway, this Canon, if it ends up being a legitimate HT contender, will not only put some downward pressure on LCOS PJs in general, but almost certainly on DLP and LCD as well. If this thing performs as hoped, it will absolutely kick the ass image-wise of anything under $8K, except in black level and onff CR.



              • #8
                Looking at the specs last night, it looks very, very nice. The only thing I'll point out is that it is native 4:3, so if you use it with 16:9 material, you're limiting your resolution to only 768 lines, or WXGA, which is already available.

                Well, we're safe for now. Thank goodness we're in a bowling alley.
                - Pleasantville


                • #9
                  Unless you buy an anamorphic lens, which is also already available. Also, WXGA DILA has not been available at a price like this (new). It's been DLP and LCD.

                  And even "limited" to WXGA (actually a hair better at 1400x788 ), this will look really really good, even at something like 140" diagonal. Ask Dean McManis. You cannot take WXGA LCD up to that size (or I would have), and it would be pushing it for DLP too, IMO.

                  Chris, you really should go see a DILA somewhere. It is a different animal. If nothing else, go check out the new JVC RPTVs at a local store.



                  • #10
                    Actually, you're right, I've never seen DILA in person, only LCD, DLP, and CRT. I'll go see if I can find one somewhere. I wonder if Best Buy would have one of the JVC's you're talking about, or if I need to go further to a boutique.

                    Well, we're safe for now. Thank goodness we're in a bowling alley.
                    - Pleasantville


                    • #11
                      With a resolution of 1400x1050, how does it handle projection of 16:9 format images? Are the un-used rows of pixels actually un-used or is there a "vertical squeeze" function similar to the one used on some models of 4:3 TVs?

                      David - Trigger-happy HTGuide Admin


                      • #12
                        They would be unused, so you would have black (grey) bars top and bottom. Also, there is no data yet as to where in the 4x3 frame it will put this 16:9 picture (remember this is a business machine primarily).



                        • #13
                          I have owned 4 JVC D-ILA projectors, and still have a G-1000 and G15 model.

                          I have not yet seen any of the native 1920 X 1080, high-end projectors yet, but the clearest looking HDTV images (comparable to the 9" CRT projector that I owned before) were the JVC/D-ILA/LCOS units.

                          I actually mostly use my tiny XGA DLP FPTV for viewing normal programming, but I always use the JVC FPTVs for HDTV material because of the extra detail revealed.

                          I do use an ISCO anamorphic lens so that I can take advantage of the projector's full 1365 X 1024 resolution for watching 16:9 material like HDTV.

                          This Canon D-ILA unit sounds great as it appears (by the specs) to be far better than my JVC FPTVs (better contrast, brighter) and for almost a 3rd of the price that I paid for my G15 (1500 lumens).

                          The D-ILA unit (without using an anamorphic lens) displays 16:9 material having black bars above and below the active 16:9 image (and of course thicker bars for 2.35:1 material). I have a 16:9 screen so HDTV material fits perfectly, and I can move the image to the top of the screen, and mask the bottom with a black felt panel that I built for viewing 2.35:1 movies. But honestly most of the time I don't bother setting it up.

                          One point is that if you have an opportunity to see a D-ILA projector, try and make sure that it has been calibrated. The newer models like the SX21, and likely this Canon unit will have some pre-calibration for viewing movies.

                          But as it has been mentioned, JVC had mostly marketed earlier units as business projectors, which favor resolution and brightness over color fidelity, contrast, and black level. Many of my JVC D-ILA projectors had a green push and only measured around 250:1 contrast out of the box (one unit was 165:1) but after calibration most centered around 800:1, which made a dramatic improvement in picture quality and image depth.

                          So either view a newer model or a calibrated one (or both) if possible.

                          As yet, I have seen the better 720P native units that look about the same as the calibrated D-ILA projectors, but even with their much higher contrast ratings, the picture quality is not yet better to my eyes with HDTV material.
                          The D-ILA's minimal pixel gap and great color fidelity produce a very "filmic" picture.
                          Although no doubt there will become a day soon when the newer advancements in other display technologies will be visibly superior, and probably for far less money as well. 8)



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