Emotiva XPA-1, a SSP-300 and some 802D's.... the $200 experiment!

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • hd99yr
    Member
    • Apr 2007
    • 43

    Emotiva XPA-1, a SSP-300 and some 802D's.... the $200 experiment!

    WARNING

    The following contains subject matter that may be extremely offensive to close minded individuals. Please click HERE to follow the Lemmings off the cliff if this applies to you.

    Please no car analogies. This is a car analogy free zone. Anyone posting one will be promptly hunted down and gutted like a fish.


    My processor is a Classe SSP-300, amplifier is a Classe cav-180 and some B&W 802D’s. I have owned a denon 2807 than went to separates with a SSP-300, mc-402 and a cav-18. But surround sound wasn’t in the cards for me and I found myself enjoying stereo more and more. Long story short as much as I loved the McIntosh I could not eliminate some line noise so it had to go. With the cav-180 the bass was almost twice that of the McIntosh but the sonic sweet warmth and detail of mid-range and highs were no where to be found. It was like the difference when I went from my Denon to the SSP-300 but in reverse. So the search goes on for the upper end of the McIntosh and the bottom end of the Classe.

    I have noticed some very favorable comments about Emotiva products so I decided to give the XPA-1 a try. After you hook it up and power them up your first Impression should be not to have a first Impression. Out of the box they are bright, flat and grainy. These babies need at least 100 hours and as many heat cycles that time allows. Around the 60 hour mark they start coming into their own. I found myself in a love hate thing the first few days reminiscent of some past relationships. The detail and bass was outstanding but so was the high end graininess lack of a sound stage and imaging.

    Than The warmth and sound stage starts to appear while the flat and grainy aspects slowly disappear. Cymbals shimmer, piano’s sound like they are in the room; bass is tight and on a good recording you can hear the sound of a finger or pick before the tone on a guitar. Voices are well defined, magical and easy on the ears. The bright presentation seemed to mellow into a warm detailed top end with accurate and powerful bass. I was starting to have a romance with these amplifiers but was it a true romance or was I just getting used to the sound.

    It was time to hook up the cav-180 and make a comparison. I used a Kenny G recording from HDnet. I believe it’s his latest DVD recorded in San Diego. What happened next was unexpected! The sound was so similar that it caught me totally off guard. The distinction was more detail in the XPA-1. The piano, Cymbals, chimes and Bongos all came alive with the XPA-1. There was one point where the drummer ran the chimes back and forth on camera. With the Classe this was very faint and if you didn’t see it on the screen you may have missed it. Not so with the XPA-1, it was there but placed just right in the scheme of things and you didn’t have to see it on the screen to know it was taking place. The soundstage sounded so similar I couldn’t point out any noticeable differences. I don’t know what I was expecting but the last thing was for an amplifier at this price point to hold it’s own with the likes of a Classe.

    One word on heat and a couple words on appearance. The word on heat is forge-abou-it. I’m fortunate in that I have a basement and built a shelf hanging from the rafters so I don’t have to look at amplifiers. I put the XPA-1’s on the carpet in front of the TV and didn’t notice that they sunk in and the bottom was closed off until day 3. Absolutely no problem with heat or performance and I was pushing them pretty hard. I have no use for the LED light and meters on the front panel. The LED light for the signal-in happily continues to blink without any input connected to the amplifier. Do yourself a favor and just flip the switches off for both on the back panel right after you remove them from the box. The back-lit power button is the highlight with a nice blue tone when on and amber in standby mode.

    The XPA-1 may fall into the bright category for some people but I would consider it warm and detailed. That said, one persons bright is another person’s Holy Grail. It’s all about personal preferences and what’s right for you. The one thing I do know for sure is that the XPA-1 is the holy grail of value and I guarantee you will never ever have the diminishing returns conversation about this amplifier. It still amazes me how similar it was to the Classe.

    The XPA-1 can be as good as what you put in front and behind it I believe. It will expose a poor quality recording with little remorse. I kept on thinking about what Glenee said about this amplifier.

    Originally posted by Glenee
    I have found the XPA-1 to be a what goes in, is what comes out Amp. No signature sound, nothing just flat ass neutral. You can change anything in your system Sources, Interconnects of different materials, speaker wire of different materials, and you can hear the change. First amp that I have ever owned that I can tell the difference in changes very quickly.
    Glenee
    The SSP-300 seems to be a good match for it as are the 802D’s. I can see where this amplifier might chew up and spit out some equipment the same way it does poor recordings. This was called the $200 experiment because Emotiva charges $25 each to ship them and I figured I could send them back for $75 each so I would be out $200 when returning them. After all who was I kidding that an amplifier at this price point would meet my needs? Next on deck was going to be a Pass labs X-350 but that plan is now on hold because these XPA-1’s have found a new home. They should be happier moving to the basement where they will have their own dedicated power lines. If you’re in the market for an amplifier of any caliber why not try your own $200 experiment. You just might be as impressed as I was.
    Last edited by hd99yr; 24 April 2009, 20:32 Friday.
    " Just when I thought I was out, THEY PULL ME BACK IN "
  • KahunaCanuck
    Senior Member
    • May 2008
    • 222

    #2
    Good write up...I like the way you compared them. :T
    Kahuna's Theatre

    Comment

    • audioqueso
      Super Senior Member
      • Nov 2004
      • 1930

      #3
      Interesting comparison. Thanks.
      I was interested in audition Emotiva, but it's more like $600 experiment to me since I am not in the US. Shipping it via FedEx international is expensive!

      I emailed a couple of B&W 800 series owners on emotiva's forum to hear what they had to say about Emotiva with B&W. I only found about 4, but 3 of them werent' as content. They said it was a great value, but a little too laid back.

      HD99YR, you seem to like the Emotiva a lot, but I suspect that it suits you because you went from a Classe, and that already has a very laid back sound. Would that be correct? I just bought a Mac, but would be interested in doing the same test.

      Excellent write up. Thank you for sharing it.
      B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

      Comment

      • ssabripo
        Senior Member
        • Dec 2005
        • 336

        #4
        bmw 135i > M3

        My simple HT setup
        4π using LMS, anyone?

        Comment

        • audioqueso
          Super Senior Member
          • Nov 2004
          • 1930

          #5
          Originally posted by ssabripo
          bmw 135i > M3

          Basically huh. I think I'm actually going to take the plunge and give Emotiva a call Monday to check out one of their 200watt amps. I'll compare it against the McIntosh.
          Last edited by audioqueso; 25 April 2009, 17:31 Saturday.
          B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

          Comment

          • sikoniko
            Super Senior Member
            • Aug 2003
            • 2299

            #6
            I think its great you were able to find value in the low cost solution. I have tried this a couple times with bad luck. I first bought the CineNova Grande 5 and then the NuForce Ref9, thinking I was paying a fraction of the price for 90% or better the performance. I found on both occasions I lost money on the sale to trade up and it would have cost me less if I just bit the bullet the first time on the amp I really wanted. It seems that last 10% was where the difference was.

            anyways, congratulations on your find and may you spend many days of happiness with your system!
            I'm just sittin here watchin the wheels go round and round...

            Comment

            • Glenee
              Senior Member
              • Aug 2006
              • 253

              #7
              I found that a pair of Van Den Hul Carbon Hybrid interconnects, due absolutely wonders with Emotiva gear. If you like that smokey Ole Bar at 2AM smooth yet detailed sound.
              Any one of these just does so much.
              Van Den Hul
              1. D102 MKIII Hybrid
              2. The Second
              3. The First Ultimate MKII Hybrid
              Went cheapest to Highest Priced. The First two can be Balanced Connections.
              I have the #1 between Pre and XPA1 and the #3 between CDP and Pre.
              Women Vocals is wonderful.
              Thanks hd99yr for the quote.
              These amps are a little harsh in the top end at the start, but then they mellow into something special after about 50 hrs. Just like you said.

              Comment

              • hd99yr
                Member
                • Apr 2007
                • 43

                #8
                Originally posted by audioqueso
                Interesting comparison. Thanks.
                I was interested in audition Emotiva, but it's more like $600 experiment to me since I am not in the US. Shipping it via FedEx international is expensive!

                I emailed a couple of B&W 800 series owners on emotiva's forum to hear what they had to say about Emotiva with B&W. I only found about 4, but 3 of them werent' as content. They said it was a great value, but a little too laid back.

                HD99YR, you seem to like the Emotiva a lot, but I suspect that it suits you because you went from a Classe, and that already has a very laid back sound. Would that be correct? I just bought a Mac, but would be interested in doing the same test.

                Excellent write up. Thank you for sharing it.

                I really missed my McIntosh. I understand why so many make this choice. I think you will notice more bass and a fuzz more detail while keeping the soft warmth. Jmo
                " Just when I thought I was out, THEY PULL ME BACK IN "

                Comment

                • hd99yr
                  Member
                  • Apr 2007
                  • 43

                  #9
                  Originally posted by sikoniko
                  I think its great you were able to find value in the low cost solution. I have tried this a couple times with bad luck. I first bought the CineNova Grande 5 and then the NuForce Ref9, thinking I was paying a fraction of the price for 90% or better the performance. I found on both occasions I lost money on the sale to trade up and it would have cost me less if I just bit the bullet the first time on the amp I really wanted. It seems that last 10% was where the difference was.

                  anyways, congratulations on your find and may you spend many days of happiness with your system!
                  I would have always doubted my decision if not for the comparison to the Classe . I was able to verify my Impressions. So hard after suffering through the break in period
                  " Just when I thought I was out, THEY PULL ME BACK IN "

                  Comment

                  • Glenee
                    Senior Member
                    • Aug 2006
                    • 253

                    #10
                    I was coming from McIntosh MC 501's and a MC252. I have experience with both. I actually like the sound of the MC252 better than the 501's.

                    Comment

                    • JustinGN
                      Senior Member
                      • May 2009
                      • 105

                      #11
                      Good writeup! Being in the market for a new AVR/Separates, Emotiva had really caught my eye for the price/features balance, and the AVS Forum users really seem to dig the brand/equipment. I'm currently using some Grado SR-60s while my 600 series speakers are in storage, and I really miss the warmth of the music and audio that came from them being hooked into my Denon 1803; yes it was old and certainly not the best, but coming from a HTiB, it was like coming out of the night only to find myself standing on the frikkin' sun, and even that analogy doesn't do the difference justice.

                      As much as I'm eager to hear music the way the artist intended, at the same time I've grown weary of the cold and almost lifeless (yet immaculately detailed for the price) sound from my SR60s. Emotiva just got another notch on my book, though it'll be a while before I can afford to sink two to three grand on gear/separates.

                      Comment

                      • mal01
                        Member
                        • Apr 2009
                        • 42

                        #12
                        Originally posted by hd99yr
                        WARNING

                        The following contains subject matter that may be extremely offensive to close minded individuals. Please click HERE to follow the Lemmings off the cliff if this applies to you.

                        Please no car analogies. This is a car analogy free zone. Anyone posting one will be promptly hunted down and gutted like a fish.


                        My processor is a Classe SSP-300, amplifier is a Classe cav-180 and some B&W 802D’s. I have owned a denon 2807 than went to separates with a SSP-300, mc-402 and a cav-18. But surround sound wasn’t in the cards for me and I found myself enjoying stereo more and more. Long story short as much as I loved the McIntosh I could not eliminate some line noise so it had to go. With the cav-180 the bass was almost twice that of the McIntosh but the sonic sweet warmth and detail of mid-range and highs were no where to be found. It was like the difference when I went from my Denon to the SSP-300 but in reverse. So the search goes on for the upper end of the McIntosh and the bottom end of the Classe.

                        I have noticed some very favorable comments about Emotiva products so I decided to give the XPA-1 a try. After you hook it up and power them up your first Impression should be not to have a first Impression. Out of the box they are bright, flat and grainy. These babies need at least 100 hours and as many heat cycles that time allows. Around the 60 hour mark they start coming into their own. I found myself in a love hate thing the first few days reminiscent of some past relationships. The detail and bass was outstanding but so was the high end graininess lack of a sound stage and imaging.

                        Than The warmth and sound stage starts to appear while the flat and grainy aspects slowly disappear. Cymbals shimmer, piano’s sound like they are in the room; bass is tight and on a good recording you can hear the sound of a finger or pick before the tone on a guitar. Voices are well defined, magical and easy on the ears. The bright presentation seemed to mellow into a warm detailed top end with accurate and powerful bass. I was starting to have a romance with these amplifiers but was it a true romance or was I just getting used to the sound.

                        It was time to hook up the cav-180 and make a comparison. I used a Kenny G recording from HDnet. I believe it’s his latest DVD recorded in San Diego. What happened next was unexpected! The sound was so similar that it caught me totally off guard. The distinction was more detail in the XPA-1. The piano, Cymbals, chimes and Bongos all came alive with the XPA-1. There was one point where the drummer ran the chimes back and forth on camera. With the Classe this was very faint and if you didn’t see it on the screen you may have missed it. Not so with the XPA-1, it was there but placed just right in the scheme of things and you didn’t have to see it on the screen to know it was taking place. The soundstage sounded so similar I couldn’t point out any noticeable differences. I don’t know what I was expecting but the last thing was for an amplifier at this price point to hold it’s own with the likes of a Classe.

                        One word on heat and a couple words on appearance. The word on heat is forge-abou-it. I’m fortunate in that I have a basement and built a shelf hanging from the rafters so I don’t have to look at amplifiers. I put the XPA-1’s on the carpet in front of the TV and didn’t notice that they sunk in and the bottom was closed off until day 3. Absolutely no problem with heat or performance and I was pushing them pretty hard. I have no use for the LED light and meters on the front panel. The LED light for the signal-in happily continues to blink without any input connected to the amplifier. Do yourself a favor and just flip the switches off for both on the back panel right after you remove them from the box. The back-lit power button is the highlight with a nice blue tone when on and amber in standby mode.

                        The XPA-1 may fall into the bright category for some people but I would consider it warm and detailed. That said, one persons bright is another person’s Holy Grail. It’s all about personal preferences and what’s right for you. The one thing I do know for sure is that the XPA-1 is the holy grail of value and I guarantee you will never ever have the diminishing returns conversation about this amplifier. It still amazes me how similar it was to the Classe.

                        The XPA-1 can be as good as what you put in front and behind it I believe. It will expose a poor quality recording with little remorse. I kept on thinking about what Glenee said about this amplifier.



                        The SSP-300 seems to be a good match for it as are the 802D’s. I can see where this amplifier might chew up and spit out some equipment the same way it does poor recordings. This was called the $200 experiment because Emotiva charges $25 each to ship them and I figured I could send them back for $75 each so I would be out $200 when returning them. After all who was I kidding that an amplifier at this price point would meet my needs? Next on deck was going to be a Pass labs X-350 but that plan is now on hold because these XPA-1’s have found a new home. They should be happier moving to the basement where they will have their own dedicated power lines. If you’re in the market for an amplifier of any caliber why not try your own $200 experiment. You just might be as impressed as I was.
                        Hey hd99yr,
                        ARE you still liking your Emotiva XPA-1`s? I just got my 802`s a couple of weeks ago. They were nice but didn`t blow me away like i remembered when i first heard them. After reading alot about Emotiva and your post in particular, i decided to get an XPA-2. I didn`t really want to drop the $ for the mono`s because i thought that might be overkill and i thought the wife might just kill me :B .

                        I could immediately tell the difference. I`m running a Pioneer Elite SC-05 by the way. The bigger soundstage and detail was there, and i was remembering way i bought these speakers. My wife and i spent hours listening to cd`s with it cranked up pretty good. Now, my question to you is do you think i would be much better served by the mono`s? It sounds good now considering that the speakers are barely broke in and i just got the amp on thursday.

                        Thanks!

                        Comment

                        • wettou
                          Ultra Senior Member
                          • May 2006
                          • 3389

                          #13
                          Originally posted by hd99yr
                          I would have always doubted my decision if not for the comparison to the Classe . I was able to verify my Impressions. So hard after suffering through the break in period
                          Are you saying the Classe CAM400 was better than the Emotiva XPA1 ?
                          Farming looks mighty easy when your plow is a pencil, and you're a thousand miles from the corn field."Dwight D. Eisenhower

                          Comment

                          • sikoniko
                            Super Senior Member
                            • Aug 2003
                            • 2299

                            #14
                            Originally posted by wettou
                            Are you saying the Classe CAM400 was better than the Emotiva XPA1 ?
                            I don't see where he said anything about a delta series amp...
                            I'm just sittin here watchin the wheels go round and round...

                            Comment

                            Working...
                            😀
                            😂
                            🥰
                            😘
                            🤢
                            😎
                            😞
                            😡
                            👍
                            👎
                            Searching...Please wait.
                            An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because you have logged in since the previous page was loaded.

                            Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                            An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because the token has expired.

                            Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                            An internal error has occurred and the module cannot be displayed.
                            There are no results that meet this criteria.
                            Search Result for "|||"