Processor & Amp for 802s,804s & HTM1?

[bbutler]

I know this is the b&w forum, but I figure you folks might now what is a the best match for my speakers. If this poor forum, I sorry. I'm a newbee
I'm in the processing of selecting an processor/amp for my home theater.

I currently have the B&W 802's, HTM-1, 804's (rear), SCM-1(sides) & Velodyne DD-15 & HGS-15X for subs

Currently, I'm auditioning the Rotel 1098 with Rotel RMB-1095 (200w x 5to 5) & Rotel RB-1090 (380wx2); and have faily happy with the results.

However, I might have a heat problem with my equipment room and am considering moving the amps to another closet using balanced output. (Or least would like the flexibility). However, the 1098 does not have balanced output. Plus, if I spend this much money, I don't want to second guess my results.

So, I'm considering a Classe ssp-60, with CAV-150, and either monoblocks or a Classe stereo amp.

So, it it worth it to jump to the next level? What would you recommend?

Thanks in advance

[Aussie Geoff]

bbutler,

Bottom line - the Classe amplifiers are generally recognised as being a at least as good and (for some) a "cut above" the Rotels (commensurate with their high prices of around 30-50%.) You will need the Classe Stereo or Monoblocks though for those B&W 802s (like the RB-1090 you have tried).

However - If money is an issue - you can easily run 20-30 ft of fully shielded RCA cables to the Rotel amplifiers from the pre-processor. What you need to do is:
1) Make sure the amps and the pre-processor are linked to a common "star" ground.
2) You get high quality fully shielded RCA cables (preferably double shielded with at least one shield being 100% foil) which have the shield not grounded at the amplifier end (thus loosing any noise)

Ideally (& I highly recommend this) listen to them both – the Rotel and the Classe have quite a different sound – you will need to decide which you prefer… :)

Geoff

[sikoniko]

I am sure this thread will probably get locked or moved, but w/ your setup, the only thing I would consider w/ rotel would be the 1098. For power, you should be considering: krell, paradigm, classe, lexicon, earthquake, or bryston in no particular order.

The issue w/ stepping into the higher line of speakers is that you need the higher line of power too in order to get the quality sound you are looking for.

[DrBoom]

For power, you should be considering: krell, paradigm, classe, lexicon, earthquake, or bryston in no particular order.

I'm sure you meant to say Parasound, because I've never heard of Paradigm making amplifiers :W

And to me, Classé isn't just "as good" as Rotel, but it really stacks up with the top amplifiers.
If I could afford it, that's what I'd have, that is to say if their surround processors and multichannel amps are as good as their stereo stuff.
For 802's I'd be looking at either CAM350 monoblocks, or if you want to go the 5-ch amp route the CAV500.
Or get a nice CA300 or CA400 for the 802's, and a CAV180 for the center and surrounds :drool:
Their current line up is fazing out as we speak, and the new Delta series will be coming shortly, but I'm afraid the prices are going to go up (again).
So I'd try to get me one of their current products, perhaps at a somewhat reduced price :)

[sikoniko]

parasound.. my bad.. dont know what i was thinking.

[jazznsoccer]

Hey bbutler,

Just curious if you"ve tried the SCM-1s v the 804s in a 5.1 face off? I'm debating the 5.1 v 7.1 set up (same equipment as you have posted about)and wondering if it's worth the extra cost of $2000 minimum.

Seems like 7.1 is not a factor for DVD-A or SACD.

[Ray]

Hi, I was planning to buy 4 x 804, htm1 and a sub, but I auditioned (I wish I did not!) the 802...
So my set will be 2x802 2x804 1xhtm1, and maybe a sub. And now i'm also looking for some power to feed them. Did any of you tried the Arcam P7? Its a 7x150w amp and mostly sells together with the Arcam AV8? I could use 4 channels for the front (802) and the other 3 for the centre and the rare. But I don't know if it is a good one for the money.

Thanks for any help!

Ray

[sikoniko]

Im not familiar w/ arcam, but 802's and 804's are power hungry. i believe the 802's are rated at 500w? and the 804's are at 200w? need more power in my opinion..

earthquake is coming out w/ a 7 channel amp that is 300w. you might want to look into that. i got my 5channel at a great price, over half below list.

[bbutler]

No, I did not audition that Arcam. But, it just read some reviews and it sounds impressive. I leaning to going with the new Classe SSP-600 sound processor, but I have to wait 60 or so days for it to ship. No real particular reason, other than my dealer recommending it. Plus, I havent heard anything bad about it, but then again, I don't hear it talked about that much.

They system looks like it's going to be


3 - Class CA-101 (bi-amp the center, others for rear)
1 Classe CA-401 for front 802's
Sound Processor TBD - leaning to the Classe SSP-600 to match others


Hoping it will sound good, and improve the Rotel (which I'm very happy with). But, if I'm going to drop this much cash, I don't want to "regret" the decision, plus I have to factor in the "wife" effect.

[bbutler]

To be honest, most movies don't seem to really drive the back speakers. Thus, I think SCM-1s are fine. However, having said that, I watch StarWars (clones), and wow it's very impressive. Is it 2k more? I think that would depend on the size of your room.

My room is rather large dedicated theather (20x30 or so). My "1st" home theater was 5.1 with 804's in the front, HTM-1 center, and SCM-1; using a Denon 5700 amp. I was very happy with the results.

However, when I put the same system in my new room (acoustics innovation room); which is not only much larger, it has all the sound deading materials. The system really lost steam. Thus, the purchase of the 802s and another Velodyne sub. But, I still need more power.

[DrBoom]

Wow, really nice system if you ask me.
I personally love Classé too, very natural and detailed sound.
Might I ask why you'll be using the "old" series for amps, and the new Delta series for a processor ?
I know it doesn't make any difference, but just for looks alone I'd get a complete Delta setup.
Anyway, you're very lucky the new Delta series is already available, it's scheduled for 2005 in Europe (not sure when).
If I had the cash, I'd seriously look into Classé as well.

[bbutler]

The delta system looks nice, but I had to draw the line some where. Since last years amps are on "close-out" there are some reasonable deals to be had. If I get all new stuff, it adds about another 30% or more to the price tag. And since the amps are going into a closet, I won't enjoy the looks, but I understand the sonically the newer stuff isn't much different.

[Fraise]

but I understand the sonically the newer stuff isn't much different.

actually i was told by my local dealer that the sound was actually quite different on the newer stuff since it was designed by their new engineers from mark levinson. the older SSP-60 and and the CDP-100 (i think) were the first products to come out from them. anyone who got their hands on the SSP-60 is lucky considering its the same damn thing as the SSP-600 but for a few thousand cheaper, granted theres no screen on it though.

[bbutler]

Well.... I actually ended up ordering the sp-600 last July, and it finally arrived last friday. Though I can't compare it to the sp-60, I can say the sound is amazing. I was running a Rotel system (on loan from the dealer). Th Rotel system sound very nice and I was wondering if it was really worth jumping "up a level". But, now have my "final" system up and running. Needless to say, I'm very pleased.

Was it worth the cost difference? I guess that's in the eye of the beholder. But, I can tell you that I will not tell my wife that I could have saved $$$. :)

My thought is once you start spending this much money, it's hard to justify anything by the cost alone. But, was it worth the cost just for the looks and touchscreen? I don't know. But, I love it none the less. It's an expectional piece, it makes my Denon 5900 look second rate.

My final stack is 5 classe CA-101 (front channels mono-block, the rear in stereo), the SP-600, and Balance Power System from BPT.

I'm in heaven.. :)

[DanR]

I have the Rotel RB-1090 with B&W 802's and feels that the extra money for the Classe is a waste unless you truly prefer their sound. They do differ from Rotel in some very fundamental ways, by this I refer purely to your ears, not quality build, prestige etc. Rotel can drive the 802's effortlessly with terrific sound. I don't think you lose a thing to Krell, Parasound, Bryston or Classe except a lot of money you can spend elsewhere.

[jordi]

What about B&K?

[Dutch in USA]

When I started looking for some serious gear I fell in love with the signature 805's.
At the dealers I put in a cd, got comfy on the sofa in the sound room and was amazed by these little speakers; their air and detail. I did not pay too much attention to what was driving it and what the source was...

I asked the dealer to set me up with Rotel RC-1090, RB-1080, RCD-1072 and the S805's. I figured that would be a good set up and looks wise stunning. I got in the room, played the same cd, stopped it after 30 seconds, went to the salesman to ask him what happened. The sound was dull and spiritless. First he explained me that the previous cd player was a $3000 Sony SACD, and that the power came from a Classe CP47.5 pre amp and CA 201 power amp. I was lost.. I had a great experience and wanted it again!

I went home and started to break all my money jarrs. I got the cd player somewhere else as it was discontinued. To save some $ I got the Classe integrated amp 151 and of course the S805's on their relatively very expensive stands..
Once I had the set up at home I called the dealer the next day to give back the 151 and get the pre amp/power amp set up. It was way over my original intend, but once you are lost, you are lost. :wink:

I love the Classe amps, they now drive my 802's and man do they drive them!
My main concern is HIFI stereo as that is what I use 95% of the listening time. For surround I feed a Yamaha Z1 pre amp signal to the CA201 and that works like a charm as it has double connections with a flip switch to select. And it would be a waste not to use the 802's! The rest of the surround is made up of the 7SE series.

Let your ears do the talking. B&W is the 1st decision, then spend some hours at the dealers with your favourite music and let them switch set ups in between. When you'll leave them a big check in the end, they might as well work for it :P

[spirited]

Well.... I actually ended up ordering the sp-600 last July, and it finally arrived last friday. Though I can't compare it to the sp-60, I can say the sound is amazing. I was running a Rotel system (on loan from the dealer). Th Rotel system sound very nice and I was wondering if it was really worth jumping "up a level". But, now have my "final" system up and running. Needless to say, I'm very pleased.

Was it worth the cost difference? I guess that's in the eye of the beholder. But, I can tell you that I will not tell my wife that I could have saved $$$. :)

My thought is once you start spending this much money, it's hard to justify anything by the cost alone. But, was it worth the cost just for the looks and touchscreen? I don't know. But, I love it none the less. It's an expectional piece, it makes my Denon 5900 look second rate.

My final stack is 5 classe CA-101 (front channels mono-block, the rear in stereo), the SP-600, and Balance Power System from BPT.

I'm in heaven.. :)
I worked for Classé Audio, and I was responsible for testing every PCB in that company. Your readers are going to love to know that they are being ripped off. The only difference between the SSP-300 and SSP 600 is one component: The balance board. The rest is exactly the same apart from the price. Your readers will also love to know that these units have a myriad of software problems; changing some key components along with the software versions every single week. If you happen to buy a SSP-600, you will shocked to know that you have to take the whole processor apart to change ONE fuse on the main power supply. PLEASE DO NOTE TAKE MY WORD FOR IT . Try it out.

[tmt]

It's strange that a lot of people are sying that the old Classe stuf is that much better than the new current series. Why is that?
It's really hard to believe.

[jlee]

I think you got that a bit mixed up... I think a lot of the people think the new Classe stuff is better, but not $$$$$$ better. I've heard the new Classe Delta and it's phenomenal, but not at the prices they are asking.I was looking for monoblocks and their entry level monoblock is now $5000 US. I ended up getting 3 CAM-200's used instead.

[spirited]

Wow, really nice system if you ask me.
I personally love Classé too, very natural and detailed sound.
Might I ask why you'll be using the "old" series for amps, and the new Delta series for a processor ?
I know it doesn't make any difference, but just for looks alone I'd get a complete Delta setup.
Anyway, you're very lucky the new Delta series is already available, it's scheduled for 2005 in Europe (not sure when).
If I had the cash, I'd seriously look into Classé as well.

I guess you would have alot of money to burn: even if it cost you less in Euros