Count down has begun...

[efarstad]

...therefore I shall call upon the brain-trust that is HTG, to help me plan and layout my HT room.

Here's what I have to work with:

Length of room: 18 feet
Width of room: Planning on 12 feet but can push to 14 feet (one wall is not built yet so I have this luxury)
Height of room: 8 feet

All of these dimensions are with unfinished walls, etc...so once drywall or related material go up dimensions will change (subtracting inches of course).

I built an opening in the front of the room to "sink" my HDTV into, so that it does not stick out into the room. I'm thinking of building an "island" in the middle of the room that will be raised for my second row of theater seats, with the first row being on the floor. I like the raised island approach instead of raising the entire back of my HT just for my second row...make sense? Shortly I'll sketch out something and post it here.

Other then that I'm looking to "hide" all my gear and speakers in columns and behind transparent walls.

So what I'm looking for from you fine folks is advice about materials, accoustics, and all that jazz. I've got a good list running but would love your feedback and input.

Ask any questions of me too!

Thanks, E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[Andrew Pratt]

well Erik my first peice of advice is to read and read some more on room acoutics There's some nice modeling softeware available that can really help you design media rooms with one at http://www.cara.de/ENU/index.html

Here's a good site for general acoustic info

http://www.acoustics101.com/welcome.htm#Welcome

I'd also recomned you make the bottom 33-36" of the room absorb sound and the upper half more reflective. The ideal sound insulation for the bottom half is a product by Johns Mansville called Insulshield (formerly called Theatershield) There's also a version called Permacote Linacoustic which is what I used. Its available in a few widths and thicknesses but most people use a 48" wide roll that's 100 feet long. The 100 foot roll was plenty to do my 23 * 12 room. You'll also want to completely cover the front wall with this insulation as well. The cost for the roll was $235 cdn (MSRP is around $260 cdn)

Depending on your budgets etc I'd highly recomend you contact dennis_erskine AT mindspring DOT com about haveing him design your theater for you...from what I've heard he's fantastic to work with. I bounced some idea's off him during my planning stages and he was very friendly to work with so I can only imagine what he's like for paying clients

I've got a few other tips and tricks I'll pass along that I've learned building my theater but I'll save those for a later date...stay tuned

[Lex]

Other then that I'm looking to "hide" all my gear and speakers in columns and behind transparent walls.

oh my, hiding all your gear and speakers??? Tell me it ain't so! If you put those Martin Logan's behind partitions, I will personally come to Washington state to rip them out, lol.

Speakers need to be out front to breath and image correctly. Unless you tell me that your MLs won't be in this setup at all, that your 2 channel is elsewhere in the house.

Hide my gear? I don't think that's ever going to be my style. I like to see the gear, being a gearhead and all. I like to see it, and i want others to see it to. No mysteries at my house. I like seeing folks expressions, whoa, look at all that stuff!

Lex

[efarstad]

Lex, you're right. My ML's are for my stereo only listening enjoyment. I have my other speakers for HT.

On the "hiding gear" topic...I have thought about this issue a lot and am not totally fixed on one or the other. I have thought about making a real clean looking setup that "shows everything" and then one that "hides" everything. My main concern, as you mentioned, is imaging...so I'm still debating.

Obviously the "all showing scenerio" would be easier and cheaper to do too!

Ouch...I'd never hide my ML's...that is a sin beyond all sins!!!

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[Andrew Pratt]

Personally I have a thing about lights on gear so I try to minimuze how much gear I see and how bright lights are etc....I'm happy when I can dim them down to a minimum

[efarstad]

The whole "gear light" situation is why I'm at least thinking about putting my gear in a closet but perhaps keeping my speakers "out"...the debate, decision, pondering continues....

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[Lex]

Ok I wasn't sure about 2 channel whether you were separate or not. Thanks for saving me a coronary.

Ok, the HT speakers, could work concealed. However, for best imaging, they will be in front of any flat panel, toed in slightly. That's just the way it is. Of course, then you have the problem of time alignment with center, unless you mount it below the screen even with mains.

I am not nearly as anal as Andrew. :LOL: I actually sort of get off on the lights. When it's dark, and the lights are glowing, movie running, my blood starts pumping.

Lex

[efarstad]

On speaker placement of the front three:

What's your take guys on the talk that the front three should form a slight "arc" where the left/right are slightly infront of the center channel? Or should they all be on the same plain? I've heard both...what's your take fellas?

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[Andrew Pratt]

I've always used the arc design to set my front three speakers..

[Markj]

Arc, I think is best if you can do it.

[David Meek]

Erik, I use direct radiators and have them in an arc. The arc is set so the speakers are equidistant to the primary listening position to insure that the sound doesn't arrive out of sync. If you don't like the arc, you can mimic the sonic behavior of the arc with speakers set in a line by using the channel delay settings on some pre-pros/receivers.

As far as hiding/showing gear, how about building a recessed cabinet with a lightly tinted glass front? That way the gear doesn't intrude into the theater space, it's still visilble and the tint cuts the light show a bit.

Hope this helps.




David - HTGuide flunky
Our "Theater"
Our DVDs on DVD Tracker

[David Meek]

Some more thoughts . . . I read somewhere that the ideal room shape for a listening room is a trapezoid as there are no parallel surfaces in it. Hopefully you aren't going to try that one! Regardless, some room shapes are better/worse than others. A round room or a perfectly square one are two examples of bad shapes. Some good room ratios:

There are several Golden Ratio room shapes that are said to reduce standing waves, flatten room response (the same thing?), etc. One that comes to mind is:

1.0 W x .61 H x 1.61 L

it doesn't look like a functional one for you because an 18 foot long room will give you a width of 11.2 feet and a height of 7 feet. You could use Bolt's ratios which are:

1.0 H x 1.14 W x 1.39 L - 12.95' H x 15.78' W x 18.0' L
1.0 H x 1.28 W x 1.54 L - 11.68' H x 14.06' W x 18.0' L
1.0 H x 1.60 W x 2.33 L - 7.72' H x 11.25' W x 18.0' L

which might be more useable depending on your ceiling height. There are others, but I don't have them documented anywhere.

FWIW, don't think these are hard and fast rules, 'cause if you don't like any of those sizes, and if you understand acoustic treatments and how they work, you can make almost any shape of room sound good.

edited for content

ops: D'oh, just saw you height dimension. Bolt's 3rd ratio looks like it's right in your ballpark.




David - HTGuide flunky
Our "Theater"
Our DVDs on DVD Tracker

[efarstad]

Wow guys thanks...I was leaning towards the arc setup!

David: Thanks for your room size input and I do think that third ratio hits a home run....and actually would be darn close to what the room would come out to once the walls and treatments go up!

Cool! 4 more weeks to go! Now I'm spending my spare time scanning through all my Home Theater Design mags and stuff for ideas!

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[efarstad]

Ok, so I've been doing some reading, yes I can read!

I want to help separate the room from the rest of the house, so have been researching dampening material...similar to the stuff Andrew mentioned above. I've read some interesting application of Roofing material in sound rooms/home theaters...ya know sheets of black/sand paper-like material on our roofs?! They say it's the "poor-man's" version of dense/mass sound barrier material! Interesting...what do you guys think?

That stuff would be hundreds cheaper then buying the real thing! I was thinking of installing that "over and through-out" my studs, then placing C-channel ontop of that, then attaching my drywall to the channels...of course caulking and sealing all the joints/holes, etc. Then I'd do a variation of carpet and other finishes ontop of the drywall. Oh, yea insulation of course too!

Ok...watcha think?

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[David Meek]

Erik, do you still need help with CARA? I'll be happy to offer any assistance I can.




David - HTGuide flunky
Our "Theater"
Our DVDs on DVD Tracker

[efarstad]

Thanks David...I'll be reaching you by e-mail.

So what do you guys think of my plan above....

Anyone...anyone....anyone....

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema

[Andrew Pratt]

Erik if you are trying to stop sound from escaping your room the best thing you can do is add mass as a barrier and try to limit physically contact between the walls and the other rooms. This isn't an easy thing to do but you might want to consider at least double sheets of drywall on the walls and maybe a sheet of MDF over then studs with the drywall over that....remember mass is your friend in this case.

[efarstad]

Andrew, I've been doing a lot of reading on acoustics and do know that mass is my friend. I plan on isolating the walls so they don't touch the flooring above and using other methods, basically a room inside a room approach. I'm just curious if that roofing material would work similar to those more expensive materials?

E





The Norwegian A/V Nut!
E-Cinema