New to B&W, demoed the CM9 yesterday. Impressions/questions

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  • southpaw75
    Junior Member
    • Jan 2010
    • 14

    New to B&W, demoed the CM9 yesterday. Impressions/questions

    Upgradeitis recently took its toll on me and there is only one prescription for it - give in to the symptoms and UPGRADE!

    My current system is no slouch, at least I don't think it is. Emotiva 8.3 towers for mains, 6.3 center and ERD-1's for my 2 surrounds. They are powered by an Emotiva XPA-5 amp and Pioneer Elite SC-07 doing the processing. My room is not a dedicated room, measuring 16' x 32' x 8' and I do have some acoustical treatments on the walls and tri-traps in the front corners. My sub is an SVS PC13 Ultra which I run in 15hz mode. My listening habits are around 75% HT/movies and 25% music. I do employ the MCACC room calibration that my Pioneer gives me but not totally sold that it's doing a good job. No independent crossovers so the universal crossover is set to 50hz.

    I've had my current speakers for almost a year and of course, when I got them, I thought they sounded terrific. I think that is mainly because they were such a step up from what I was using. Now that the new smell has worn off and I've gotten more educated on what things SHOULD sound like, I know I can do better and get something that I'll be happy with for many years. So I set out to find the best in my price range which is $5k and my research has led me to the B&W CM9's. 800 series is out due to price.

    So I stopped by local B&W dealer and I was there for a good 2 hours yesterday. He had CM9's set up next to the Paradigms Studio 100's so I tested some material on Blu-ray and CD and I much preferred the laid back, warm tone of the B&W's. The Paradigms were just a bit too harsh and in my face. Just didn't care for their tone. I was simply blown away with what I was hearing out of the CM9's. It made me realize what I'm missing and what it feels like to hear "high end". The neutrality, nice tight bass along with detail and clarity that I'm missing from my current 6.3 center. In my setup, pans just aren't as seamless as they should be. Someone walks off camera while they are talking and their voice jumps from the center to the right speaker. Hearing the same scene yesterday on the CM9's, the voice made a gradual movement from the center to the right. Perfect. Imaging was spectacular. As you can probably tell, I fell in love.

    The dealer did say I could take home the demo mains for an in-home trial so I will take him up on that. I want to be sure they sound just as great in my room. I do have one problem with the series - I hate the bookshelf surrounds, the CM1's. I do not want to go back to a direct firing surround, as I really like the dipole/bipole design of my current ERD's. I use them in bipole mode mainly. My options would be to go with the DS3 or stick with what I have now. Here are the specs on the ERD's. Can anyone tell me if they would be a good blend with the CM9's just going by the numbers and specs? I think for movies they'd be fine but I worry about multi-channel music.
    ERD-1:

    • One 5.25" Woofers, two 25mm tweeters

    • Sensitivity: 89db (2.83volts @ 1 Meter)
    • Recommended amplifier power: 50-200 Watts RMS

    • Frequency response: 80-20Khz +/-2db

    • Four possible switch postions:

    1. Left/Right Bipole
    2. Left Dipole
    3. Right Dipole
    4. Left/Right Inverted Dipole

    (read more about Bipole/Dipole settings in the ERM1/ERD1 PDF manual)
    • 4.25" deep, 13" wide, 9.5" tall

    • 29.5 lbs. pair (boxed) - 11 pounds each, unboxed

    ALL ERM/ERT/ERD SPEAKERS:

    Drivers

    • Proprietary tri-fiber composite cone is light weight and rigid with low resonance
    • NBR surround for enhanced cone edge termination
    • Proprietary high performance motor structure
    • Integrated copper and aluminum shorting rings to reduce distortion and 2nd and 3rd order harmonics
    • Flat progressive rate spider with venting under spider
    • Cast aluminum frame
    • 25mm tweeter
    • Wide surround silk dome diaphragm
    • High power motor structure
    integrated heat-sink mounted on motor structure
    • Ferro-fluid cooled voice coil
    • Internally damped, low resonance rear chamber

    • 4 ohms

    So that is one question. The other question is are these ever on the used market? If so, where is the best place to look for them used other than Audiogon? The dealer will not come down from the MSRP of $3k for the mains plus $1250 for the CMC2 center. I'd really like to get a break on the price and find mint used ones but other than Audiogon, not sure where else to look.

    Thanks for reading this and I welcome any and all comments/suggestions. Hopefully, I'll be joining the B&W family soon. 8)
  • Hammie
    Senior Member
    • Oct 2005
    • 304

    #2
    You should be able to tell when you do the in-home demo.

    I would wait until then.
    Panasonic TC-P65VT30
    Onkyo Pro PR-SC5508 | M2Tech Young DAC | Emotiva XPA-1 (x3), XPA-2
    Oppo BDP-93 | DirecTV HR23-700 HD-DVR | Pioneer PL-670 Turntable
    Sony Playstation 3 | Nintendo Wii | Apple TV 2, Mac Mini (iTunes Server), iPad
    B&W 804S, HTM3S, CWM DS8 | SVS PB12-NSD | Denon AH-D2000 Headphones
    Tripp Lite HT1210ISOCTR Power Conditioner, SMART1000LCD UPS System
    My Bowers & Wilkins 800 Series Setup
    Next Upgrade: Cables

    Comment

    • stuofsci02
      Super Senior Member
      • Nov 2009
      • 1241

      #3
      Southpaw75,

      I see you have made the jump over here from the Emotiva forum.. Welcome!

      It looks like those CM9's really gave you an itch that needs to be scratched. They are a wonderful sounding speaker.

      If you prefer the di-poles for movies, I suggest you stay with your ERDs. I don't think you will find it a problem since with di/bi pole speakers you are creating more of a sound envelope.

      For me multichannel music and di/bi pole just doesn't sound right, but you indicated you use for mostly movies. I would suggest keeping your ERDs, at least for the time being.

      Now as far as used CM9's.. They do come up now and again on Audiogon, but the CM9s were only about $1400 less then the 804s and are only two years old. My feeling is a lot of people who went to buy the CM9 ended up with 804s because the upgrade price wasn't huge and you get so much with the 804s. So I don't think there are lot of them out there yet.

      Now that the 800 series starts at $5000 for the 805Di you will see more people purchase the CM9. I think you will have to wait more then a year before they start to pop-up used on a regular basis and at a reduced price.

      Have you considered going used on the 800 series.. If you like the CM9s, and the imaging they make, you will love the 800 series.. You can pick up 805S with stands used for $2000-2400, an HTM4S for $1000, and a nice sub to fill in the base for $1000.

      IMO opinion this would be a very nice improvement over the CM9's in sound, and serious improvement in the looks dept.
      Main System:
      B&W 801D
      Emotiva USP-1 Pre-Amp
      Chord SPM-650 Stereo Amp
      Oppo BDP-105
      Squeezebox Touch


      Second System:
      B&W CM7
      Emotiva UMC-1
      Emotiva UPA-2
      Oppo BDP-83SE
      Grant Fidelity DAC-09

      Comment

      • hifiguymi
        Super Senior Member
        • Mar 2007
        • 1532

        #4
        The 804S is a better sounding speaker than the CM9 but it's less forgiving as well. Depending on the system the CM9 may work better. Also there is a big difference in the matching center channels. The CMC2 is $1250.00 and the HTM3S is $2800.00 and if someone is using the system for mainly home theater, a matching center is pretty important. I'm not saying the 804S shouldn't be considered. There is more to it than just those speakers.

        Eric

        Comment

        • emig5m
          Senior Member
          • Aug 2008
          • 646

          #5
          I always wondered how Emotiva speakers stacked up to B&W. Look forward to hearing about your in-home demo experience. 10 to 15% off seems like the standard to me and I wouldn't consider anything less than 15% off MSRP on new B&Ws myself personally. And the 804S is very nice. Very clean and effortless sound. Every other speaker I hear now sounds "dirty" and I can pick up flaws with other speakers easier than I ever could before. The 800s are just very clean and pure. I'd rather get used 804S before brand new CM9. Full MSRP for the CMs.... Well if you're rich and money isn't an issue then go for it, lol. :lol: Myself, I never pay full price for anything anymore. If I can't pay a price I think is fair....I walk without hesitation. :

          If you do the in-home demo and you have to have them, I would take them back and tell the dealer you'll take them for 15% off and that's it. If they wont do it, leave your number if they decide to change their mind. They'll be calling you back to get the sale, lol. With this economy and dealers going out of business left and right, a half a loaf of bread is better than no loaf at all.

          Comment

          • stuofsci02
            Super Senior Member
            • Nov 2009
            • 1241

            #6
            Originally posted by hifiguymi
            The 804S is a better sounding speaker than the CM9 but it's less forgiving as well. Depending on the system the CM9 may work better. Also there is a big difference in the matching center channels. The CMC2 is $1250.00 and the HTM3S is $2800.00 and if someone is using the system for mainly home theater, a matching center is pretty important. I'm not saying the 804S shouldn't be considered. There is more to it than just those speakers.

            Eric
            I don't think anyone mentioned the 804
            Main System:
            B&W 801D
            Emotiva USP-1 Pre-Amp
            Chord SPM-650 Stereo Amp
            Oppo BDP-105
            Squeezebox Touch


            Second System:
            B&W CM7
            Emotiva UMC-1
            Emotiva UPA-2
            Oppo BDP-83SE
            Grant Fidelity DAC-09

            Comment

            • emig5m
              Senior Member
              • Aug 2008
              • 646

              #7
              Originally posted by hifiguymi
              The 804S is a better sounding speaker than the CM9 but it's less forgiving as well. Depending on the system the CM9 may work better. Also there is a big difference in the matching center channels. The CMC2 is $1250.00 and the HTM3S is $2800.00 and if someone is using the system for mainly home theater, a matching center is pretty important. I'm not saying the 804S shouldn't be considered. There is more to it than just those speakers.

              Eric
              Well I first demoed the 804S on the latest high end Conrad Johnson gear. Room acoustics sounded very similar to my own. Well dampened and sound with no clap echo at all. Even my own voice sounded very similar in the demo room. Well my room might be a little more dead up top. I can't say the 804 sounds that much different on the Conrad Johnson than my simple Yamaha and Emotiva system?

              And I think the center channels are the true highlight of the 800s. Having the common horizontally wide center cabinets with the tweeter outside of the box really gives you that "sound comes out of thin air" experience. Very airy and detailed sound with the out of the box tweeter. And there seems to be no limit with how well they can perform as the source recordings get better that brick wall of speaker performance is more eliminated. The brick wall is now shifted towards the source recording material. But I don't believe you absolutely need high end gear to experience the performance gains of the 800s - source recording, yea, I'll agree there.

              Comment

              • hifiguymi
                Super Senior Member
                • Mar 2007
                • 1532

                #8
                Originally posted by stuofsci02
                I don't think anyone mentioned the 804
                Huh? You did in the post right before me.

                Eric

                Comment

                • southpaw75
                  Junior Member
                  • Jan 2010
                  • 14

                  #9
                  I appreciate all the comments. Guys, I wish the 804s were in my budget but even used, they are above what the CM9's are new. I see a pair of used 804s on ebay right now, black ash, for $3325 + shipping. Then I need to find a matching center (HTM3S??) somewhere because it doesn't look like he has that for sale.

                  Comment

                  • hifiguymi
                    Super Senior Member
                    • Mar 2007
                    • 1532

                    #10
                    Originally posted by emig5m
                    Well I first demoed the 804S on the latest high end Conrad Johnson gear. Room acoustics sounded very similar to my own. Well dampened and sound with no clap echo at all. Even my own voice sounded very similar in the demo room. Well my room might be a little more dead up top. I can't say the 804 sounds that much different on the Conrad Johnson than my simple Yamaha and Emotiva system?

                    And I think the center channels are the true highlight of the 800s. Having the common horizontally wide center cabinets with the tweeter outside of the box really gives you that "sound comes out of thin air" experience. Very airy and detailed sound with the out of the box tweeter. And there seems to be no limit with how well they can perform as the source recordings get better that brick wall of speaker performance is more eliminated. The brick wall is now shifted towards the source recording material. But I don't believe you absolutely need high end gear to experience the performance gains of the 800s - source recording, yea, I'll agree there.
                    I totally agree that all of the 800 Series speakers, center channels included, are very open and detailed. I would disagree with you about the electronics however. The source can get better and better to get better performance, but you still need a good pipeline to get all of that information to the speakers.

                    The main point I was trying to make was with the 804S compared to the CM9, not only do you have the increase in those speakers, you have an increase in the center channel and that is a big increase.

                    Eric

                    Comment

                    • timjclark
                      Senior Member
                      • Apr 2009
                      • 104

                      #11
                      Originally posted by southpaw75
                      I appreciate all the comments. Guys, I wish the 804s were in my budget but even used, they are above what the CM9's are new. I see a pair of used 804s on ebay right now, black ash, for $3325 + shipping. Then I need to find a matching center (HTM3S??) somewhere because it doesn't look like he has that for sale.
                      I am using a HTM4S with my 803S's and I am very happy with the performance. So, that would be an option over the 3s - I'm just saying. Now, I have never heard the 4S vs the 3S, and I've never heard the 3S for that matter so perhaps I'm missing out big time. Anyway...

                      If used 804S's are not an option, might Nautilus 804 be an option? 800 series speakers are worth the stretch if you can do it. Heck, for the price of the CM9's, you could get 801 or 802 series II/III's. If my wife was not opposed the the looks of the 801 Series II's, I would have gone that route over my at least twice the money 803S's.
                      -B&W: 803S, HTM4S, M-1
                      -Proceed: CDD, PDP, PRE, AMP-2, AMP-3
                      -Rotel: RSP-1069
                      -Sony: PS3, KDF-E42A10

                      Office system:
                      -Arcam DV-89, AVR100
                      -B&W LM-1, AS-1

                      Comment

                      • southpaw75
                        Junior Member
                        • Jan 2010
                        • 14

                        #12
                        Originally posted by timjclark
                        I am using a HTM4S with my 803S's and I am very happy with the performance. So, that would be an option over the 3s - I'm just saying. Now, I have never heard the 4S vs the 3S, and I've never heard the 3S for that matter so perhaps I'm missing out big time. Anyway...

                        If used 804S's are not an option, might Nautilus 804 be an option? 800 series speakers are worth the stretch if you can do it. Heck, for the price of the CM9's, you could get 801 or 802 series II/III's. If my wife was not opposed the the looks of the 801 Series II's, I would have gone that route over my at least twice the money 803S's.
                        Actually the 804's on ebay that I mentioned above are actually Nautilus 804 and not 804s. Bought in 2004. So yes, they are an option but still an expensive one, more than brand new CM9's.

                        Comment

                        • timjclark
                          Senior Member
                          • Apr 2009
                          • 104

                          #13
                          Originally posted by southpaw75
                          Actually the 804's on ebay that I mentioned above are actually Nautilus 804 and not 804s. Bought in 2004. So yes, they are an option but still an expensive one, more than brand new CM9's.
                          Ahhh. Those on eBay are on the pricey side. I see there is a pair of N804's on audiogon right now for 2550 obo + shipping. And the data for N804s on audiogon have the average selling price at $2480, last selling price was $2470 and the lowest selling price of $1930.

                          If nothing else, you could use this as a bargaining chip with your dealer to get a discount on the CM9s. I also have never paid list price for B&W's (or any other high end audio). From my experience, dealers will always "deal" at least to some degree.
                          -B&W: 803S, HTM4S, M-1
                          -Proceed: CDD, PDP, PRE, AMP-2, AMP-3
                          -Rotel: RSP-1069
                          -Sony: PS3, KDF-E42A10

                          Office system:
                          -Arcam DV-89, AVR100
                          -B&W LM-1, AS-1

                          Comment

                          • southpaw75
                            Junior Member
                            • Jan 2010
                            • 14

                            #14
                            Originally posted by timjclark
                            Ahhh. Those on eBay are on the pricey side. I see there is a pair of N804's on audiogon right now for 2550 obo + shipping. And the data for N804s on audiogon have the average selling price at $2480, last selling price was $2470 and the lowest selling price of $1930.

                            If nothing else, you could use this as a bargaining chip with your dealer to get a discount on the CM9s. I also have never paid list price for B&W's (or any other high end audio). From my experience, dealers will always "deal" at least to some degree.
                            Thanks for the info regarding Audiogon prices. I will take a further look at that particular deal.
                            I was very surprised that the dealer wasn't going to negotiate, especially since I was thinking of buying multiples. He just said, nope, the list price is my price. Of course he said things like there isn't much margin there to begin with but that's what they all say plus things like the price/performance ratio is already so high with the price they are at. It certainly is making me think twice about buying from him. And this was the general manager of the store.

                            Comment

                            • southpaw75
                              Junior Member
                              • Jan 2010
                              • 14

                              #15
                              Originally posted by timjclark
                              Ahhh. Those on eBay are on the pricey side. I see there is a pair of N804's on audiogon right now for 2550 obo + shipping. And the data for N804s on audiogon have the average selling price at $2480, last selling price was $2470 and the lowest selling price of $1930.

                              If nothing else, you could use this as a bargaining chip with your dealer to get a discount on the CM9s. I also have never paid list price for B&W's (or any other high end audio). From my experience, dealers will always "deal" at least to some degree.
                              Wow, those do look beautiful. And he has the matching center HTM1 for sale too. Oh man..... Never thought I'd even be looking at the 800 series, even used....

                              Comment

                              • timjclark
                                Senior Member
                                • Apr 2009
                                • 104

                                #16
                                Originally posted by southpaw75
                                Wow, those do look beautiful. And he has the matching center HTM1 for sale too. Oh man..... Never thought I'd even be looking at the 800 series, even used....
                                They are beautiful. Are you located anywhere close to that seller to take them for a spin?

                                I often wonder if I'd be better served by a HTM1 vs the HTM4S to go with my 803S's. The HTM3S was just out of reach for me and now they no longer sell them. :x
                                -B&W: 803S, HTM4S, M-1
                                -Proceed: CDD, PDP, PRE, AMP-2, AMP-3
                                -Rotel: RSP-1069
                                -Sony: PS3, KDF-E42A10

                                Office system:
                                -Arcam DV-89, AVR100
                                -B&W LM-1, AS-1

                                Comment

                                • stuofsci02
                                  Super Senior Member
                                  • Nov 2009
                                  • 1241

                                  #17
                                  Originally posted by hifiguymi
                                  Huh? You did in the post right before me.

                                  Eric
                                  Not as a suggested speaker to get.. I only noted that a lot of people made the jump to the 804 and skipped the CM9 all together and as such there are not a lot of CM9s on the used market.

                                  You'll note that I suggested the used 805s with the HTM4s center and sub as an alternative to the CM9. Price comes to about $4000 which is less then the $5000 he had budgeted. All of the above are available on Audiogon right now in rosenut.. I believe this combo would best the CM9 with CM Center 2..
                                  Main System:
                                  B&W 801D
                                  Emotiva USP-1 Pre-Amp
                                  Chord SPM-650 Stereo Amp
                                  Oppo BDP-105
                                  Squeezebox Touch


                                  Second System:
                                  B&W CM7
                                  Emotiva UMC-1
                                  Emotiva UPA-2
                                  Oppo BDP-83SE
                                  Grant Fidelity DAC-09

                                  Comment

                                  • jamesdaman
                                    Senior Member
                                    • Apr 2008
                                    • 136

                                    #18
                                    I went from 683's to 805s with the stands, id never go back again. Yeh ok the bass doesnt go as low but who cares everything else makes up for that

                                    Comment

                                    • emig5m
                                      Senior Member
                                      • Aug 2008
                                      • 646

                                      #19
                                      Originally posted by southpaw75
                                      Thanks for the info regarding Audiogon prices. I will take a further look at that particular deal.
                                      I was very surprised that the dealer wasn't going to negotiate, especially since I was thinking of buying multiples. He just said, nope, the list price is my price. Of course he said things like there isn't much margin there to begin with but that's what they all say plus things like the price/performance ratio is already so high with the price they are at. It certainly is making me think twice about buying from him. And this was the general manager of the store.
                                      I got 10% off right from the start on my very first purchase and I didn't even ask for a discount. Offer a deal you think is worth it, if they don't except, shop elsewhere.

                                      Comment

                                      • emig5m
                                        Senior Member
                                        • Aug 2008
                                        • 646

                                        #20
                                        Originally posted by jamesdaman
                                        I went from 683's to 805s with the stands, id never go back again. Yeh ok the bass doesnt go as low but who cares everything else makes up for that
                                        Just out of curiosity, did you miss the FST mids? I know I did when I went from 683 to 685. Even fully plugging the bass ports and crossing over to the sub I couldn't get the midrange performance of the 683's FST mid. I never listened to the 805S yet but was just wondering how you think the midrange stacks up...

                                        Comment

                                        • jamesdaman
                                          Senior Member
                                          • Apr 2008
                                          • 136

                                          #21
                                          its a gragizillion times better then the 683 in the mids, vocals are Bang in the middle like they are fricken there. the 683s sounded abit repressed if you know what i mean, im listening to the who right now. Probably the best band of all time

                                          Comment

                                          • southpaw75
                                            Junior Member
                                            • Jan 2010
                                            • 14

                                            #22
                                            Well, I've been researching the Nautilus 804, 804s and CM9's for the last couple hours. I've noticed a couple things...a number of posters here confirmed that the 804s improved on the N 804 in a few ways such as the FST mid, better crossover, and something else. Then I saw this post: http://www.htguide.com/forum/showpos...65&postcount=9 in which the owner says his CM9's sounded better than the N 804. So I guess this kind of puts me back to where I started, because I'm not saving much money if any at all by looking at used N 804 vs. mint CM9.
                                            Unless some out of sight deal came along for a pair of 804s....

                                            Comment

                                            • stuofsci02
                                              Super Senior Member
                                              • Nov 2009
                                              • 1241

                                              #23
                                              Have you looked at 805s?
                                              Main System:
                                              B&W 801D
                                              Emotiva USP-1 Pre-Amp
                                              Chord SPM-650 Stereo Amp
                                              Oppo BDP-105
                                              Squeezebox Touch


                                              Second System:
                                              B&W CM7
                                              Emotiva UMC-1
                                              Emotiva UPA-2
                                              Oppo BDP-83SE
                                              Grant Fidelity DAC-09

                                              Comment

                                              • southpaw75
                                                Junior Member
                                                • Jan 2010
                                                • 14

                                                #24
                                                Originally posted by stuofsci02
                                                Have you looked at 805s?
                                                Oh yeah, sorry, I meant to answer you about that. I'm looking for towers only for my mains. Just an aesthetic preference I have for my room.

                                                Comment

                                                • Opus007
                                                  Senior Member
                                                  • Nov 2007
                                                  • 454

                                                  #25
                                                  Southpaw,
                                                  Get what pleases you the most and what is in your budget.If you like the CM9's and like them even more after demoing them at home then you are still getting a vast upgrade from the Emotiva speakers.And you will be getting a fine speaker in the CM9's.
                                                  In my personal opinion all B&W speakers are fine speakers.Some here on this forum will advise you to move up in series but you have to consider what is you price limit.
                                                  As for the dealer standing firm...find another dealer.I can tell you that a dealer giving you 15% off is not going to hurt him.He is just being greedy and I would not deal with him.I would tell him that you can do better elsewhere and if he will not budge stand firm and go elsewhere.I have not paid msrp on any of my gear or speakers and have gotten as much as 25% to 30% off.If you lived in California I could direct you to a couple of dealers who would love to make a deal with you as times are hard in the highend audio industry right now.Dealers are dropping like flys.
                                                  Good luck with your new adventure.

                                                  Comment

                                                  • RedRock
                                                    Junior Member
                                                    • Jan 2010
                                                    • 29

                                                    #26
                                                    Southpaw,
                                                    I recommend you definitely shop elsewhere. Considering today's economy, there's no room for greed and a reasonable discount should be expected. Just last week, I was set to upgrade to the 804s/HTM3s only to find they've just been discontinued and are no longer available. Anyway, my dealer was willing to go 20% off the top without negotiation. This is consistent with the discount he gave me on my Arcam electronics last year.

                                                    BTW, I demoed the CM9s w/ CM Centre 2 and thought the sound quality was great for the price range - a noticeable step up from the KEF iQs.

                                                    Good luck with your purchase.

                                                    Eric
                                                    B&W 804Di (L/R mains)
                                                    B&W HTM4Di (center)
                                                    B&W SCMs (surround)
                                                    Arcam AVR-600
                                                    Arcam DV-137
                                                    Arcam irDock
                                                    Velodyne Optimum-10
                                                    Furman Elite 15 PF

                                                    Comment

                                                    • dan87951
                                                      Senior Member
                                                      • Nov 2005
                                                      • 379

                                                      #27
                                                      I have had lots of B&W speakers over the years and the Nautilus 804 has never been a good speaker in my opinion. To me the Nautilus 804 was built for a price point and sounded shallow and overly bright. I actually upgraded my theater room from N804's to CM9's and to me the CM9's sounded fuller. However the 804S is a much better speaker than the N804's (more bass and bigger soundstage). With that being said do the 804S if you can but if your buying new I think the CM9 is a better bargin because once your ready to move into the 800 series skip the 804 all together and start at the 803!! You have to remember the N804s are over 10 years old now (introduced in 1998). As for the guy on ebay those are N804's and hes dreaming....
                                                      dan87951
                                                      audio guru

                                                      Comment

                                                      • theblue
                                                        Senior Member
                                                        • Dec 2009
                                                        • 116

                                                        #28
                                                        If you haven't listened to the 683 I recommend you give them a fair shot. My recent opinion (I got my 683s last black friday) was that it wasn't worth spending more unless I was going to man up and get something in the 8xx series. The 683 is a massive step forward from anything labeled a 6xx in the past. I'm not saying they're perfect, the fit and finish is blah, there is some cabinet noise, but the overall value and technology put into them makes them miles above anything at their pricepoint.

                                                        I've noticed that more than one person on these forums has own 683s and then jumped right to the 804 or similar.
                                                        Marantz SR5002 (music fed by apple airport express via optical)
                                                        rotel RB-985 THX (4 channels bipowering fronts, 1 for the center)
                                                        B&W - 683, CDM-CNT, CDS3 (sides), DM601 (rears)
                                                        a combo of haveflex and audioquest cables.

                                                        Comment

                                                        • jamesdaman
                                                          Senior Member
                                                          • Apr 2008
                                                          • 136

                                                          #29
                                                          When i got my 683's it was either that or CM7's. Though the 7's were slightly better i didnt think at the time it was worth the jump. After the 683's you gotta be looking at the 8XX's, anything inbetween doesnt to my mind seem to worth it.

                                                          Comment

                                                          • Dmantis
                                                            Moderator Emeritus
                                                            • Jun 2004
                                                            • 1036

                                                            #30
                                                            I'm a huge fan of the CM line. I think for the money they are simply spectacular . I see no reason to try and get into the 800 series if the CM9's blow you away. I much prefer them over the Studio 100's. I don't like the overly brightness of that model. I don't really like Paradigm that much to be honest. They make some nice sounding in wall and on wall models but there floor standing models have much room for improvement.

                                                            The CM9's are a speaker I'd like buy myself. I almost picked up the CM7's just because I liked them so much. I went with a friend to listen to them and they blew me away. I was not shopping for speakers that day.

                                                            Comment

                                                            • Hammie
                                                              Senior Member
                                                              • Oct 2005
                                                              • 304

                                                              #31
                                                              Have you had the chance to read over the CM HT setup review in Home Theater Magazine, yet?

                                                              It's a pretty good read.
                                                              Panasonic TC-P65VT30
                                                              Onkyo Pro PR-SC5508 | M2Tech Young DAC | Emotiva XPA-1 (x3), XPA-2
                                                              Oppo BDP-93 | DirecTV HR23-700 HD-DVR | Pioneer PL-670 Turntable
                                                              Sony Playstation 3 | Nintendo Wii | Apple TV 2, Mac Mini (iTunes Server), iPad
                                                              B&W 804S, HTM3S, CWM DS8 | SVS PB12-NSD | Denon AH-D2000 Headphones
                                                              Tripp Lite HT1210ISOCTR Power Conditioner, SMART1000LCD UPS System
                                                              My Bowers & Wilkins 800 Series Setup
                                                              Next Upgrade: Cables

                                                              Comment

                                                              • southpaw75
                                                                Junior Member
                                                                • Jan 2010
                                                                • 14

                                                                #32
                                                                Originally posted by Hammie
                                                                Have you had the chance to read over the CM HT setup review in Home Theater Magazine, yet?

                                                                It's a pretty good read.
                                                                Yes, read it a few weeks ago and that's what initially got me interested in the B&W's.

                                                                Comment

                                                                • southpaw75
                                                                  Junior Member
                                                                  • Jan 2010
                                                                  • 14

                                                                  #33
                                                                  There is a used pair of 703's on A'gon right now for $1999 + $130 shipping. This seems like a good price. The ad is by a reputable B&W dealer and says they are in excellent condition. So I guess I'm asking, is this a fair deal? And since I'm not very familiar with the 700 line, what center should I look for that would be a good match with the 703? A center is important since I favor HT/movie usage. Thanks.

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • leej
                                                                    Member
                                                                    • Feb 2009
                                                                    • 82

                                                                    #34
                                                                    Originally posted by southpaw75
                                                                    There is a used pair of 703's on A'gon right now for $1999 + $130 shipping. This seems like a good price. The ad is by a reputable B&W dealer and says they are in excellent condition. So I guess I'm asking, is this a fair deal? And since I'm not very familiar with the 700 line, what center should I look for that would be a good match with the 703? A center is important since I favor HT/movie usage. Thanks.
                                                                    That's what I paid for my pair, when I purchased them used. I had been looking at the CM9's, which had just been released, comparing them to the 703's in the same store. I liked the 703's better and had a chance for a good deal on the used set (local), so I grabbed them and have been very pleased. I thought about holding out for a better price, but these aren't as available as others. Actually, he dropped 50 bucks for the local pick-up, since he didn't have to bother with shipping.
                                                                    My preference was the 804s, but I found these close enough for my old ears and wallet.
                                                                    As for a center, there's always the HTM7. I auditioned the CMc 2 and didn't care for them. I was using an older CDMcnt, which I liked better, but when I listened to the HTM4, I knew what I needed. I settled for a good deal on a used HTM2, which I am very satisfied with.
                                                                    Lee J

                                                                    Denon 4311ci; Rotel RB-1080; OPPO BDP-83 Universal Disk/Media Player
                                                                    B&W 703 mains; B&W HTM2 Center; B&W CDM SNT-Surr; B&W CDM1nt-back; Pair of Rythmik F15 Subs

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • stuofsci02
                                                                      Super Senior Member
                                                                      • Nov 2009
                                                                      • 1241

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by southpaw75
                                                                      There is a used pair of 703's on A'gon right now for $1999 + $130 shipping. This seems like a good price. The ad is by a reputable B&W dealer and says they are in excellent condition. So I guess I'm asking, is this a fair deal? And since I'm not very familiar with the 700 line, what center should I look for that would be a good match with the 703? A center is important since I favor HT/movie usage. Thanks.
                                                                      I'm afraid the 700 series doesn't off a lot in terms of center.. HTM7.... I have heard mixed reviews over it though..
                                                                      Main System:
                                                                      B&W 801D
                                                                      Emotiva USP-1 Pre-Amp
                                                                      Chord SPM-650 Stereo Amp
                                                                      Oppo BDP-105
                                                                      Squeezebox Touch


                                                                      Second System:
                                                                      B&W CM7
                                                                      Emotiva UMC-1
                                                                      Emotiva UPA-2
                                                                      Oppo BDP-83SE
                                                                      Grant Fidelity DAC-09

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • southpaw75
                                                                        Junior Member
                                                                        • Jan 2010
                                                                        • 14

                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by leej
                                                                        That's what I paid for my pair, when I purchased them used. I had been looking at the CM9's, which had just been released, comparing them to the 703's in the same store. I liked the 703's better and had a chance for a good deal on the used set (local), so I grabbed them and have been very pleased. I thought about holding out for a better price, but these aren't as available as others. Actually, he dropped 50 bucks for the local pick-up, since he didn't have to bother with shipping.
                                                                        My preference was the 804s, but I found these close enough for my old ears and wallet.
                                                                        As for a center, there's always the HTM7. I auditioned the CMc 2 and didn't care for them. I was using an older CDMcnt, which I liked better, but when I listened to the HTM4, I knew what I needed. I settled for a good deal on a used HTM2, which I am very satisfied with.
                                                                        Thanks for your thoughts. What about the 703's did you like better when you auditioned them vs. the CM9's? Was it because the tweeter on top? What sonic differences did you hear?
                                                                        Also, these 703's are in cherry; is your HTM2/703 combo in cherry as well? If so, do they match up pretty well cosmetically? I see an HTM2 in cherry on ebay for auction so I could snatch that up if I get the 703's.

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • Ken49r
                                                                          Senior Member
                                                                          • Dec 2007
                                                                          • 312

                                                                          #37
                                                                          704 / HTM7 would be the perfect match in the 700 series. The 704 being a 2 1/2 way floorstander handles both HT and music very well. Absolute Sound gave it many awards.

                                                                          This would be the path I would take, then you could focus on high end electronics as the next project. The 700's will sound even better and when you decide to upgrade speakers again you will already have the compatible gear in your system.

                                                                          The 800 series are great speakers but as hifiguymi (Eric) pointed out they are very revealing, and will expose weak links in a system.

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • leej
                                                                            Member
                                                                            • Feb 2009
                                                                            • 82

                                                                            #38
                                                                            Originally posted by southpaw75
                                                                            Thanks for your thoughts. What about the 703's did you like better when you auditioned them vs. the CM9's? Was it because the tweeter on top? What sonic differences did you hear?
                                                                            Also, these 703's are in cherry; is your HTM2/703 combo in cherry as well? If so, do they match up pretty well cosmetically? I see an HTM2 in cherry on ebay for auction so I could snatch that up if I get the 703's.
                                                                            I have the Black Ash, but would have preferred the red cherry, as my CDM speakers were. I think the natural cherry looks much better than black, but wouldn't fit my room. The lighter colors seem to show the beauty of the wood vaneers better.
                                                                            As for the sound, the 700's seemed more open, to me. The highs sold me, but some might preferr the CM9's. When I auditioned them, the CM9's were in a different room and moving from the room with the 703 to the Cm9 didn't impress me, near as much as moving from the room with CM9's the the 703's. I was sold! Of course, the room has very good accoustics, as they demand. Some have discribed them as somewhat birght. In a room with no carpet, or poor accoustics, this might become evident.
                                                                            I wouldn't trade my 703's for CM9's as I preferr the cabinets and the sound.
                                                                            Lee J

                                                                            Denon 4311ci; Rotel RB-1080; OPPO BDP-83 Universal Disk/Media Player
                                                                            B&W 703 mains; B&W HTM2 Center; B&W CDM SNT-Surr; B&W CDM1nt-back; Pair of Rythmik F15 Subs

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • COhifi
                                                                              Junior Member
                                                                              • Nov 2008
                                                                              • 14

                                                                              #39
                                                                              I have a pair of 703s and love them. I have my 703s with a HTM2d center and ds7 surrounds. I like the match, but want to upgrade my fronts to 803ds and move the 703s to surround duty with the ds7.

                                                                              However, I would highly recommend the 703s over the cm9s. The cabinets really make a big difference in the sound. The fst mid is fast, accurate, and detailed. If I was planning for a long term 703 system, I would buy the HTM1 as my center. This is truly a terrific center channel speaker. I think it has an early version of the Fst mid as well as an aluminum tweeter. Even the bass drivers are similar. I have heard it and was very pleased. It is a little on the big side, but this with the 703s would give you a full range of great sound (good bass across the front). In my opinion a 703 system with an htm1 center would give you a system that is just slightly below 804s system at a much cheaper price and a large step up from the cm9 system.

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • southpaw75
                                                                                Junior Member
                                                                                • Jan 2010
                                                                                • 14

                                                                                #40
                                                                                Okay guys - just brought home by new CM9's and CMC2 in Gloss Black. Got a good deal from a dealer who used them to demo in his showroom. Can't wait to do some A/B ing.
                                                                                Glad to be a part of the B&W family.

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • timjclark
                                                                                  Senior Member
                                                                                  • Apr 2009
                                                                                  • 104

                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  Originally posted by southpaw75
                                                                                  Okay guys - just brought home by new CM9's and CMC2 in Gloss Black. Got a good deal from a dealer who used them to demo in his showroom. Can't wait to do some A/B ing.
                                                                                  Glad to be a part of the B&W family.
                                                                                  Congrats!!! I look forward to hearing what your ears have to say about them! :P
                                                                                  -B&W: 803S, HTM4S, M-1
                                                                                  -Proceed: CDD, PDP, PRE, AMP-2, AMP-3
                                                                                  -Rotel: RSP-1069
                                                                                  -Sony: PS3, KDF-E42A10

                                                                                  Office system:
                                                                                  -Arcam DV-89, AVR100
                                                                                  -B&W LM-1, AS-1

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • bnieman
                                                                                    Senior Member
                                                                                    • Jun 2006
                                                                                    • 202

                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Originally posted by COhifi
                                                                                    I have a pair of 703s and love them. I have my 703s with a HTM2d center and ds7 surrounds. I like the match, but want to upgrade my fronts to 803ds and move the 703s to surround duty with the ds7.

                                                                                    However, I would highly recommend the 703s over the cm9s. The cabinets really make a big difference in the sound. The fst mid is fast, accurate, and detailed. If I was planning for a long term 703 system, I would buy the HTM1 as my center. This is truly a terrific center channel speaker. I think it has an early version of the Fst mid as well as an aluminum tweeter. Even the bass drivers are similar. I have heard it and was very pleased. It is a little on the big side, but this with the 703s would give you a full range of great sound (good bass across the front). In my opinion a 703 system with an htm1 center would give you a system that is just slightly below 804s system at a much cheaper price and a large step up from the cm9 system.
                                                                                    +1... I've got a 703/HTM-1 system and it is fantastic. I upgraded from the HTM7 and it was totally worth it.
                                                                                    Guide: Ripping DVD-Audio Discs (DVD-A) to FLAC in Windows

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • vacwm
                                                                                      Junior Member
                                                                                      • Nov 2010
                                                                                      • 9

                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      southpaw how do you like your CM9? i am thinking about them

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • BdoUK
                                                                                        Junior Member
                                                                                        • Sep 2007
                                                                                        • 15

                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        I've also got my eyes on a CM9 - CMC2 combo so I'd love to hear some impressions as well .

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • redbook
                                                                                          Junior Member
                                                                                          • Nov 2010
                                                                                          • 2

                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          bryston

                                                                                          Has anyone used Bryston amps with B&W speakers?

                                                                                          Comment

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