Stryke's world class DIY, PR based sub available

Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • ThomasW
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 10934

    Stryke's world class DIY, PR based sub available

    For those that don't already know, Deon Bearden's custom TC-Sounds SAT HE-15, and matching PR's are available for a limited time and at a great price.


    And if you don't know of/about Deon, he is a world class speaker designer/engineer. He's literally spent several years testing and perfecting this combo

    For those needing a small box with tremendous output when mated with the proper amp, this is THE system.

    John Janowitz (he's Mr Stryke) is doing the DIY audio commmunity a tremendous service offering these drivers and matching PR's virtually for cost.




    theAudioWorx
    Klone-Audio

    IB subwoofer FAQ page


    "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson
  • ThomasW
    Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2000
    • 10934

    #2


    This is the first "published" picture I've seen using the Stryke HE-15" and matching PR's. This is a prototype unit. The actual Stryke drivers will have an aluminium cone.

    The cube is appro. 22" on a side, and uses 2 of the matching PR's.

    People interested have until monday Nov 20th to place an order. Then these drivers disappear at the $375ea price. After that date the drivers will only be available from the high-end car audio dealers and will cost appro $1000ea.




    theAudioWorx
    Klone-Audio

    IB subwoofer FAQ page


    "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

    Comment

    • Lexman
      Super Senior Member
      • Jun 2000
      • 1777

      #3
      Awesome looking drivers Thomas. So, you order 1 driver you get the passive, n/c?

      How do you think this driver will rate comparatively speaking to say, an MK MX driver? I think that's a fair comparison driver. Now, if you want a second level of comparison, how about the Aerial sub driver?

      This sub that is pictured, what they have 2 active and 2 passive drivers in it? I assume it must have passives on the back side. What do you think about this sub from a construction standpoint. Is that a waist of a perfectly good driver? In other words, would they have been much better off to put them in 2 seperate cabinets, in terms of quality and high output?

      What's the rated wattage on this driver?

      Thanks,

      Lex

      Comment

      • ThomasW
        Moderator Emeritus
        • Aug 2000
        • 10934

        #4
        Lex

        There's almost nothing commercially available that compares to this driver.

        The optimal configuration is one of the SAT HE-15 combined with 2 of the HEPR-15's or 3 of the more modest SAPR-15".

        Sorry no you pay for the PRs as well. The HEPR-15s are $150 ea, the SAPR-15s are $45 ea

        So the bottom line for the sub in the picture is $675 for the Stryke hardware. Not cheap, but it truly is world class

        Powerhandling is well in excess of one kilowatt.

        There's only one active driver in the picture. That's seen on the right. One the left is one of 2 passive radiators.

        If you look closely you can see hardware (huge bolt with a nut) in the middle of the PR. That's used to mass load it (machine washers are added or subtracted). PR based systems use the air pressure inside the box to move the PR's. They need a certain amount of mass (weight) in order to function properly. Understand PR's function in a manner similar to ports, the extreme LFE is radiated by them.

        The benefit of this type of design is that comparitively small box, can generate extreme levels of output at quite low frequencies when driven by a powerful enough amp.

        As a comparison it would take 4 of your Velex subs, to approximate the output from the sub in the above picture.

        For those not familar with the project that led to the creation of the Stryke driver, here's the thread detailing the creation of Deon's "BEAST". It uses an 18" driver and 3-18" PR's, and is appropriately named. Go to the "pictures" link first. Then after you pick your jaw up off the floor, read the article





        theAudioWorx
        Klone-Audio

        IB subwoofer FAQ page


        "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

        Comment

        • Lexman
          Super Senior Member
          • Jun 2000
          • 1777

          #5
          Ok, what if, you didn't do the passive thing, and just used the drivers in 2 cabinets similar to my velex, with standard ports?

          Also, how much power is required for these bad boys anyway? Can you drive them with 300 watts at 4 ohms?

          How tight will this sub be for music?

          thanks,

          Lex

          Comment

          • ThomasW
            Moderator Emeritus
            • Aug 2000
            • 10934

            #6
            HE-15 T/S Parameters*

            Fs: 26 Hz
            Qms: 6.0
            Qes: .345
            Qts: .326
            Vas: 106.7 L
            Re: 6 ohm
            BL: 27.3 Tm
            no: .529%
            1W SPL: 89 dB
            Cms: .145 mm/N
            Mms: 257 grams
            Rms: 7.0 kg/s
            Xmax: 22.85 mm
            3.5" p-p excursion
            dual 3ohm VC
            aluminum cone

            This driver can move a lot of air, the P-P of 3.5" is tremendous, so it's really not designed to use ports. They would need to be monsterously large to prevent "chuffing". The Vas of the driver is low, so they like "small" boxes. Any appropriately sized port used would be sticking up like a periscope.

            Parameters on the Lambda style PR's:
            Fs: 4.9Hz
            Mms: 1000 grams
            Vas: 978L
            Sd = 830cm2(1/3 surround)
            Vd = 4.85L
            Xmax = 28mm one way
            Cms: .97 mm/N

            "Normal" listening levels could be easily reached with 300 watts/channel. This woofer is designed to perform above "reference" levels 24/7 and never break a sweat.

            It should be quite "musical" if properly tuned.




            theAudioWorx
            Klone-Audio

            IB subwoofer FAQ page


            "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

            Comment

            • JonMarsh
              Mad Max Moderator
              • Aug 2000
              • 15261

              #7
              Though this is "DIY", maybe it should go in the "XTREME" category!
              Folks, to get a handle on what this is about, take the Carver "True Subwoofer", which uses small drivers, and a small box to get fairly reasonable output levels; now, scale this up to a 15" driver and two PR's, all capable of 2" p-p plus travel...
              are you beginning to get the picture? The appropriate port for the output levels and very low tuning required would be a TRUE periscope- not practical inside a box.
              Hope ThomasW pops for a set of drivers and builds it- but he doesn't have any personal use for it, so we're going to have to really egg him on to get him to do it, guys.


              Regards,

              Jon




              Earth First!
              _______________________________
              We'll screw up the other planets later....
              the AudioWorx
              Natalie P
              M8ta
              Modula Neo DCC
              Modula MT XE
              Modula Xtreme
              Isiris
              Wavecor Ardent

              SMJ
              Minerva Monitor
              Calliope
              Ardent D

              In Development...
              Isiris Mk II updates- in final test stage!
              Obi-Wan
              Saint-Saëns Symphonique/AKA SMJ-40
              Modula PWB
              Calliope CC Supreme
              Natalie P Ultra
              Natalie P Supreme
              Janus BP1 Sub


              Resistance is not futile, it is Volts divided by Amperes...
              Just ask Mr. Ohm....

              Comment

              • Lexman
                Super Senior Member
                • Jun 2000
                • 1777

                #8
                I love a challenge. It could be that my Velex enclosure might be closer than you think to handling this. dual 4" ports. to be honest, I have NEVER heard a whoosh, and it will lay your ears back. Of course, I wouldn't be going for an 8 hz tune anyway. To me, that's neither practical, nor necessary. Most real world bass never goes below 20, right?

                Lex

                Comment

                • Bing Fung
                  Ultra Senior Member
                  • Aug 2000
                  • 6521

                  #9
                  This driver in simulation still perplexes me. How is it that a driver that begins rolling off at 70 something Hz be considered flat at 20 much less the purported 12-16 Hz?

                  Help me understand this but it seems to expect a lot from room gain or massive amounts of power, or both.

                  It would also seem that room placement on this would be very critical, yes/no?

                  Don't get me wrong, I applaud the small size and expected performance. I just don't understand the design principles enough to have confidence to attempt one of these with out a step by step kit plan designed by somebody in the know (Tho.. )for me.

                  And it's pretty darned expensive!




                  Bing
                  Bing

                  Comment

                  • ThomasW
                    Moderator Emeritus
                    • Aug 2000
                    • 10934

                    #10
                    Lex

                    There isn't a lot of stuff below 20H, but there is enough on DVD soundtracks to cause some people problems. My guess is that there will be more and more of this on recordings, why? Because it sells.

                    It's not a "whoosh" sound. "Chuffing" is like the noise made when blowing over the top of a bottle, just before the note comes out

                    It would be difficult to hear chuffing in your Velex subs. The length of the tubes combined with the elbows would damp most of it.

                    Bing

                    Here's the instructions for the kit, build a box with 4.3 cu ft net internal volume. Cut 3 holes, install woofer and 2-PR's. Add mass to PR's to adjust tuning to desired frequency.

                    Sorry just goofing on you :B

                    This driver/PR combo is very difficult to model. Software isn't designed to deal with the extremes this driver creates. Yes it starts rolling off at 70Hz. And yes again both room gain and high power are necessary for it to function.

                    Room placement won't be anymore critical than any other sub. You just need an air space in front of the PR's, they need to breath.

                    The system isn't "cheap" by DIY standards. But there are subs that retail for thousands, that don't have as good a components

                    To all

                    Please understand that this sub wasn't designed/built in a vacuum. Many of the best speaker designers on the planet have been consulted. There has been a constant flow of info back and forth regarding this design for a long time, but this hasn't been in the public eye. Those people following ALL the online audio forums have seen only the tip of the information iceberg.

                    There are legal agreements between designers, production facilities, retailers, etc, that prevent full disclosure about the design and it's development. Sorry but that's just the nature of business today.

                    We should be thankful that Deon, John Janowitz and TC-Sounds, et. al, were able to reach an agreement that allowed DIYers access to this technology at the "relatively" modest price.




                    theAudioWorx
                    Klone-Audio

                    IB subwoofer FAQ page


                    "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

                    Comment

                    • Lexman
                      Super Senior Member
                      • Jun 2000
                      • 1777

                      #11
                      Thomas, it's definitely interesting, and I am thankful that folks put this effort into this. I read a good bit of the writeup you pointed us to, and it is quite impressive. Unfortunately, I cannot provide the kind of airspace, omnidirectionally speaking, that I would like to have. So, it's likely a bad choice for my location. But I have pondered a second subwoofer project someday, and sell the velex's to someone locally. I don't know what kind of interest they would attract. But my guess is, that the subs should bring 450-500 each, minus the power. What do you think Thomas?

                      Of course, I have some money invested here, and I would want to recoupe most of that. But I would not sell the Velex until I saw that the replacement was a better performer!

                      Waw thinking about dual 15" woofs, or keep one 12, and build a complementary 15.

                      Lex

                      Comment

                      • ThomasW
                        Moderator Emeritus
                        • Aug 2000
                        • 10934

                        #12
                        Lex

                        I'm not sure about the resale value of used DIY subs, even ones as nicely finished as yours. My guess is that you estimate is a little too optimistic.

                        Yes PRs definitely impose some placement restrictions. Also people need to understand that they (PRs) can't be placed in an up or downward firing position.

                        If you want to "upgrade" I'd suggest 2-15" if you are thinking about a normal 15" driver




                        theAudioWorx
                        Klone-Audio

                        IB subwoofer FAQ page


                        "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

                        Comment

                        • Lexman
                          Super Senior Member
                          • Jun 2000
                          • 1777

                          #13
                          Well, I guess maybe I was optimistic. But if I couldn't recover cost, I would just rob my components from it, and burn the cabinet in the fireplace I guess, lol. (kidding, to much glue, and I only have gas logs)

                          I actually had thought about building 2 15"ers.

                          Lex

                          Comment

                          • Tom Vodhanel
                            Junior Member
                            • Sep 2000
                            • 18

                            #14
                            >>>I love a challenge. It could be that my Velex enclosure might be closer than you think to handling this. dual 4" ports. to be honest, I have NEVER heard a whoosh, and it will lay your ears back.40mm of Xsus each way?

                            You'd need (very roughly) about 3x the port flow capabilities...but that's assuming enough amp to take advantage of the travel.



                            >>>Of course, I wouldn't be going for an 8 hz tune anyway. To me, that's neither practical, nor necessary. Most real world bass never goes below 20, right?20hz...in fact, drops under 25hz are pretty rare.

                            There are a few discs that drop well below 20hz though(571,TPM,Haunting dts,SS,ect)...and these appear to be getting a little more common.

                            In a perfect world---you'd have reference+6dB capability down to DC in every HT. Unfortunately, HT enthusiasts are forced to make trade offs. Do you want X clean output from 25hz and up...or do you want X -5dB of clean output from 20hz and up...or perhaps X -10dB of clean output from 15hz and up? Roughly, these examples may all cost about the same amount of money---in many scenarios.

                            I personally have a pair of the HE15s ordered from John(Stryke)...and may commit to 4 of them soon. This isn't a deal that's going to present itself often...as TW has already stated...these aren't the usual *DIY driver*...you miss this deal, and you'll be forced to bargain with your local auto-sub dealer starting with a $1000 retail price.


                            TV

                            Comment

                            • EMT
                              Member
                              • Aug 2000
                              • 44

                              #15
                              Bing said...

                              How is it that a driver that begins rolling off at 70 something Hz be considered flat at 20 much less the purported 12-16 Hz?

                              I've seen all of the posts about these drivers and I've been wondering this too.

                              and Tom V. said...

                              ...you miss this deal, and you'll be forced to
                              bargain with your local auto-sub dealer starting with a $1000 retail price.


                              Are these really car sub drivers? I've often read that ppl should shy away from car sub drivers for home audio use because they are designed to take advantage of the cabin gain that one gets from a car that you wouldn't get in a real room. Is that being made up for here by the ability of this driver to take gobs of power?

                              Believe me, I'm not trying to put down these drivers. I don't know squat about driver design. I'm just trying to understand what seems to be a contridiction to everything I've heard/read in the past. I would find any comments on this to be very helpful.

                              Ellen

                              Comment

                              • ThomasW
                                Moderator Emeritus
                                • Aug 2000
                                • 10934

                                #16
                                Hi Ellen

                                RE: Significant differences between speakers "designed" for car vs home.

                                Any actual differences manifest themselves as T/S parameter changes to make the drivers more user friendly to the actual installation. So for example, so called "car" woofers will have a lower Vas. This is to allow max performance from the smallest possible box. Usually the "trade-off" for this is a slightly higher Fs.

                                As for the "70Hz roll-off", not to worry, this is in the "sim", the real world operation this isn't a significant issue.

                                RE: cabin gain vs rooom gain. Yes there are larger increases in cabin gain vs room gain, but again is this is true regardless of the woofer chosen. So something like a Shiva or SV-12 will manifest the same differences when installed in a car vs a HT.

                                As far as "designing" of this drivers I'd suggest going with what Deon and John are already using the 4.3 cu ft cube and 3 prs. If you're not going to be pounding the driver, then the lower excursion SAPR-15s will work. OTOH, people that want to recreate rock concert SPLs should use the HEPR-15s. Use of the lower priced SAPR-15s run at lower SPL should result in a "better" sounding sub because there will be less of a potential issue of problems associated with surround vibrations from the "smaller" surround on the Strkye/Lambda PRs




                                theAudioWorx
                                Klone-Audio

                                IB subwoofer FAQ page


                                "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

                                Comment

                                • Tom Vodhanel
                                  Junior Member
                                  • Sep 2000
                                  • 18

                                  #17
                                  >>>As for the "70Hz roll-off", not to worry, this is in the "sim", the real world operation this isn't a significant issue.80mm of total travel...only to match it with a wuss-amp,and then balk at spending a little money for an EQ if they decide they need one? I hope not...but it wouldn't suprise me either.


                                  TV

                                  Comment

                                  • ThomasW
                                    Moderator Emeritus
                                    • Aug 2000
                                    • 10934

                                    #18
                                    Stryke HE-15 pre-order extended 2 more weeks.

                                    Prototype box info and software sim plot posted to the following website. Prototype cube sent to Tom Nousaine for an evaluation






                                    theAudioWorx
                                    Klone-Audio

                                    IB subwoofer FAQ page


                                    "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

                                    Comment

                                    • EMT
                                      Member
                                      • Aug 2000
                                      • 44

                                      #19
                                      Hello Thomas,

                                      Any actual differences manifest themselves as T/S parameter changes to make the drivers more user friendly to the actual installation. So for example, so called "car" woofers will have a lower Vas. This is to allow max performance from the smallest possible box. Usually the "trade-off" for this is a slightly higher Fs.

                                      I get that. At least I think so. But what makes this driver different from others that makes it recommended for use in a home sub? This is just idle curiosity; I have no plans to buy one of these drivers.

                                      Ellen

                                      Comment

                                      • ThomasW
                                        Moderator Emeritus
                                        • Aug 2000
                                        • 10934

                                        #20
                                        Ellen

                                        What makes this driver unique is the extreme amount of excursion. 3.5" peak to peak, combined with the low Vas 106.7L, the huge magnet BL 27.3Tm. All this adds up to a driver capable of very high SPLs, playing quite low, with massive power handling, from a 22" cube.

                                        The performance could of course be duplicated by multiple less expensive drivers, mounted in a significantly larger box. Something like 3 or 4 SV-12"s/Shiva's/Lambda 12"s in a huge EBS ported box, would have "similar" performance.




                                        theAudioWorx
                                        Klone-Audio

                                        IB subwoofer FAQ page


                                        "Complicated equipment and light reflectors and various other items of hardware are enough, to my mind, to prevent the birdie from coming out." ...... Henri Cartier-Bresson

                                        Comment

                                        Working...
                                        😀
                                        😂
                                        🥰
                                        😘
                                        🤢
                                        😎
                                        😞
                                        😡
                                        👍
                                        👎
                                        Searching...Please wait.
                                        An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because you have logged in since the previous page was loaded.

                                        Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                                        An unexpected error was returned: 'Your submission could not be processed because the token has expired.

                                        Please push the back button and reload the previous window.'
                                        An internal error has occurred and the module cannot be displayed.
                                        There are no results that meet this criteria.
                                        Search Result for "|||"