IPOD's and CD storage systems

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  • Mitchell
    Senior Member
    • Sep 2004
    • 202

    IPOD's and CD storage systems

    I just hooked up my IPOD to my 2 channel system and am surprised at how good it sounds for a compressed format.
    Also what a great way to have great music cycling through the house in random orders!!
    I see the future and it is not CD players!
    Mitchell
  • jim777
    Senior Member
    • Mar 2005
    • 831

    #2
    Are you saying that your ipod sounds as good as your RCD-1072....? For what kind of music?

    Comment

    • Kevin D
      Ultra Senior Member
      • Oct 2002
      • 4601

      #3
      I'm using an Escient Fireball for all of my music. It's a hard drive music storage system that connects to the net and downloads all the info on your music. Definitely doesn't replace CD's, but since it does have a choice of compression ratios I can decide which one's need better sound or not.

      Plus it can control 3 400 disc Sony changers. So while the Sony's aren't 1072's either, my 400 'good' discs are played at full CD quality, while the ones on the hard drive can suffer (mostly my wife's)

      With storage prices dropping like crazy, soon it will be cheap enough to to everything completely uncompressed anyway.

      Kevin D.

      Comment

      • Mitchell
        Senior Member
        • Sep 2004
        • 202

        #4
        No, the IPOD doesnt sound as good as the 1072 usually.
        But I have noticed over time and have mentioned in postings that the 1072 seems to lay bear many of the imperfections in poor recordings. Music that I have been listening to for decades would come across with the bad production front and center.
        Some classic rock, jazz and blues recorded decades ago does sound better IMHO on the IPOD.
        What I really think is interesting is the direction it is going.
        To have thousands or tens of thousands of songs (or more!) all in one small storage device, categorized in logical ways and able to be mixed and matched effortlessly to suit any mood or event (party, dinner, cleaning the house, date etc.) is amazing.
        My wife even commented about all the songs she was hearing that we never put on.
        The IPOD randomly played some Joe Jackson, that we hadnt heard for years and then some Astrud Gilberto, Cowboy Junkies and Velvet Underground. Not a usual mix in our house. We wouldnt really hear that combo on any NYC radio that I am aware of either.
        Its all music that picked over decades and then edited. Its kind of like a soundtrack to your life!
        Mitchell

        Comment

        • mjb
          Super Senior Member
          • Mar 2005
          • 1483

          #5
          Mitchell, cool! Enjoy your iPod!
          - Mike

          Main System:
          B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
          Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

          Comment

          • mjb
            Super Senior Member
            • Mar 2005
            • 1483

            #6
            Originally posted by Kevin D
            With storage prices dropping like crazy, soon it will be cheap enough to to everything completely uncompressed anyway.
            Thats what I do - I've ripped my CD collection with iTunes in Apple Lossless, and it sounds fantastic!
            - Mike

            Main System:
            B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
            Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

            Comment

            • thyname
              Senior Member
              • Jan 2005
              • 358

              #7
              I connect my Ipod to my RC-1070 through its tuner input (where do you connect yours in your 1070? My aux is taken with a universal player), and really sounds good. But of course not as good as RCD-1072... definitelly.

              BTW mjb, how do you do this "lossless" conversion with your IPOD? I don't rip my CDs, I just use my Ipod to store musice downloaded legally from the internet.

              Comment

              • mjb
                Super Senior Member
                • Mar 2005
                • 1483

                #8
                Originally posted by thyname
                BTW mjb, how do you do this "lossless" conversion with your IPOD? I don't rip my CDs, I just use my Ipod to store musice downloaded legally from the internet.
                I don't! Lossless files will eat up the iPods memory pretty fast, and the iPod doesn't have a digital output. Personally, I use the optical output from a G5 Mac, connected to a RSP-1098. I've ripped my CD collection using iTunes and Apple Lossless. AFAIC it sounds pretty good, but I've not got a RCD-1072 to compare.
                - Mike

                Main System:
                B&W 802D, HTM2D, SCMS
                Classé SSP-800, CA-2200, CA-5100

                Comment

                • Azeke
                  Super Senior Member
                  • Mar 2003
                  • 2123

                  #9
                  Indeed, I connect my IPOD to my 1098, and it doesn't sound as good as my RCD-1070, but I can certainly play a lot of tunes.

                  Peace and blessings,

                  Azeke

                  Comment

                  • lifeinabox
                    Junior Member
                    • Jun 2004
                    • 14

                    #10
                    Sound quality out of an Ipod depends upon what connection you are using. Headphone out generally sounds like crap but the line-out of the Ipod is decent.

                    I use a Roku M1000 through the my RSX-1055 DAC. Decent SQ, convenient, and a breeze to setup and use.

                    Comment

                    • Swilliams97
                      Junior Member
                      • Jul 2005
                      • 11

                      #11
                      I am using Apple's Airport Express with Airunes and beem my iTunes wirelessly from my computer to my 1098 with I can then control playlists and songs with a laptop in my livingroom. Works Great.
                      Steve

                      Comment

                      • Miroku
                        Member
                        • Jul 2004
                        • 79

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Swilliams97
                        I am using Apple's Airport Express with Airunes and beem my iTunes wirelessly from my computer to my 1098 with I can then control playlists and songs with a laptop in my livingroom. Works Great.
                        Steve

                        Wow that sounds cool. Could I bug you for some details on how it works, and can a 1068 do the same thing? I am thinking of getting a 1068.

                        Comment

                        • Kevin D
                          Ultra Senior Member
                          • Oct 2002
                          • 4601

                          #13
                          Moving since this is more an IPOD thread then Rotel. Should get some more input here.

                          Kevin D.

                          Comment

                          • Swilliams97
                            Junior Member
                            • Jul 2005
                            • 11

                            #14
                            Should work equally as well with the 1068

                            Comment

                            • ajpoe
                              Senior Member
                              • Jul 2004
                              • 439

                              #15
                              I have a 250 GB hard drive with my CD collection (about 7500 songs) ripped in lossless monkey's audio and still plenty of room to add more. It is great to just turn on random and you never know what is going to play. I run the optical out of my soundcard to my DAC1 and then to my 1068's analog inputs. I am still looking for the best software to run my system though. I currently just use winamp... foobar seems a bit too complicated for me and I like a nice looking interface. I am using a trial of J. River's media center right now and I really like the tagging support and some of the other features it has such as album art downloads. If anyone has another one I should consider, please let me know. I use an iMon IR receiver with my Harmony remote in the living room and an ATI RF RemoteWonder to control the system from my bedroom.
                              AJPoe - - Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional!

                              Comment

                              • bigburner
                                Super Senior Member
                                • May 2005
                                • 2649

                                #16
                                Originally posted by lifeinabox
                                Sound quality out of an Ipod depends upon what connection you are using. Headphone out generally sounds like crap but the line-out of the Ipod is decent.
                                Why the difference? Does this mean - for example - that the iPod has 2 soundcards, an 8-bit for headphones and a 16-bit for line out? If so, why wouldn't Apple use a single 16-bit soundcard?

                                Comment

                                • junior77blue
                                  Senior Member
                                  • Nov 2004
                                  • 635

                                  #17
                                  It's the built in preamp vs. the headphone output....one is meant to drive headphones while the other is meant to drive a home stereo. I'm sure someone can chime in with the voltage output, mVolt vs. Volt I would be guessing.

                                  Comment

                                  • jim777
                                    Senior Member
                                    • Mar 2005
                                    • 831

                                    #18
                                    A line-out is low-impedance, and the standard for a headphone output includes a 100-120ohm output resistor. Probably that the headphone output goes through a different op-amp too. No, not two complete sound cards for sure...

                                    Comment

                                    • PewterTA
                                      Moderator
                                      • Nov 2004
                                      • 2901

                                      #19
                                      This is why I'm happy my PC is connected to my HT via optical connection, then I don't have to worry I know my Processor is decoding all of it and it sounds fantastic...

                                      Plus I'd like to see one of those iPods hold my 400GB of music that I have.
                                      Digital Audio makes me Happy.
                                      -Dan

                                      Comment

                                      • tboooe
                                        Senior Member
                                        • Jun 2005
                                        • 657

                                        #20
                                        I have about 2000 CDs which I was never able to enjoy because I was not able to catalog in such a way that made it easy for me to access all of my music. So now, I use the Sonos digital music system. I have all of my music ripped at VBR 256 mp3 onto an NAS that is connected to my wireless router. The Sonos is able to access these files without the need for a pc to be on. Each Sonos box also has its own 50w amplifier and analog outputs so I can have music anywhere I can get a signal by just connecting some speakers to the Sonos box. For example, in my bedroom I have some B&W dm601s3 connected to the Sonos and it sounds great for what it is. I also use a Sonos in my main system. I am now able to fully enjoy my music because the Sonos has enabled me to quickly and easily access my entire library. I also use a dedicated CDP (Cary 303/300) for times when I really want to listen critically. I dont think mp3 is as good as my cdp but for the majority of the time, the quality is just fine.

                                        I am not sure what the future of music but it looks like compression technology is getting to the point where it is very difficult to distinguish from the original source. It is still very nice and convenient to be able to purchase a cd and just pop into your player without first having to rip it, tag, and normalize its volume.

                                        Comment

                                        • xk8boy
                                          Senior Member
                                          • Jul 2005
                                          • 104

                                          #21
                                          i have been eyeing awhile now for something like this.

                                          Comment

                                          • tboooe
                                            Senior Member
                                            • Jun 2005
                                            • 657

                                            #22
                                            you know, i prefer the Sonos system (www.sonos.com) because you can add any amount of external storage you want, it does not need amplification, it is small enough to be placed anywhere, it is wireless so it is nice and convenient to have all of my music in one place and have the entire house share it, its remote control is great!

                                            Comment

                                            • audioqueso
                                              Super Senior Member
                                              • Nov 2004
                                              • 1930

                                              #23
                                              I have a music server that has nothing but all my CDs ripped with EAC at 192 VBR. Then I use the optical output and let my Marantz do all the processing. Even though it sounds good, I only use it as 'around the house' music. Any kind of music, rap, classical, ballads, anything just to have music playing. I don't use it for serious listening because I've heard from 320kbps to windows lossless compression and there is one thing that all ripped have in common: they loss soundstage dramatically. It may sound ok with some speakers, but with my B&W 805s, it really shows how inferior ripped music is compared to pre-recorded.
                                              B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                              Comment

                                              • aud19
                                                Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                                • Aug 2003
                                                • 16706

                                                #24
                                                you could just get big HD's and rip the wav files audioqueso
                                                Jason

                                                Comment

                                                • audioqueso
                                                  Super Senior Member
                                                  • Nov 2004
                                                  • 1930

                                                  #25
                                                  Originally posted by aud19
                                                  you could just get big HD's and rip the wav files audioqueso
                                                  1000 CDs at about a gig each??? Yeah right... that's a big ass harddrive.

                                                  That's a terabyte, isn't it
                                                  B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                                  Comment

                                                  • aud19
                                                    Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                                    • Aug 2003
                                                    • 16706

                                                    #26
                                                    CD's at most are 700Mb, most aren't that much... at say an average of 600Mb per disc times 1000, that's "only" about 590Gb, so two 300Gb drives would take care of it
                                                    Jason

                                                    Comment

                                                    • jim777
                                                      Senior Member
                                                      • Mar 2005
                                                      • 831

                                                      #27
                                                      Any lossless compression (like Monkey or FLAC) should cut those requirements in half. So at 600MB/CD on average, at 50% compression on average, you "only" need 300GB for 1000 CDs...

                                                      Comment

                                                      • aud19
                                                        Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                                        • Aug 2003
                                                        • 16706

                                                        #28
                                                        But then you have to start ripping your DVD's on to the server too a few nice Raid 5 arrays of ~5+ 250Gb-300Gb drives and you're all set :lol:
                                                        Jason

                                                        Comment

                                                        • jim777
                                                          Senior Member
                                                          • Mar 2005
                                                          • 831

                                                          #29
                                                          5*300Gb!! Holy cow! I'd be satisfied with only one 300Gb drive: a McIntosh MS300 :T

                                                          Comment

                                                          • bigburner
                                                            Super Senior Member
                                                            • May 2005
                                                            • 2649

                                                            #30
                                                            A lot of you chaps are coming out of the closet on this thread!

                                                            Comment

                                                            • audioqueso
                                                              Super Senior Member
                                                              • Nov 2004
                                                              • 1930

                                                              #31
                                                              Originally posted by jim777
                                                              Any lossless compression (like Monkey or FLAC) should cut those requirements in half. So at 600MB/CD on average, at 50% compression on average, you "only" need 300GB for 1000 CDs...
                                                              Monkey has the same effects as all the other ripping formats, loss of soundstage. I'm happy with my music server. It serves its purpose well. However, it will never replace my CDs for serious listening.
                                                              B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                                              Comment

                                                              • PewterTA
                                                                Moderator
                                                                • Nov 2004
                                                                • 2901

                                                                #32
                                                                I've never had Monkey or FLAC loose soundstage... Though I don't use Monkey really for anything other than just playing around with it, I like FLAC much better. Anyone that can really tell the difference between FLAC and the actual CDs (provided they are going through the same DACs) has some absolutely amazing ears, beyond normal human hearing...

                                                                For me, I just have 4x300GB (so 1.2TB) for my media server. It's backed up over a couple of SDLT tapes on my Quantum SDLT Tape Drive (~160/320 a tape) and I just do a differential backup whenever I add a new CD to it. Granted this isn't as quick as a raid config where I can pop in a new drive and it mirrors the drive...but I've spent a lot less and have a reliable backup solution. I also have a .bin/.cue of each of my CDs, so I'm about ready to sell all my CDs (roughly 300-400 some) and get some good cash on them.

                                                                I'm using Nero Ultra 7 (will be released on October 12th) and working towards using Nero "Home" -- which so far is awesome -- as my full HTPC media server. So far the setup and use of it is very easy... I would recommend someone looking into it if they want a fast/easy setup of an HTPC. It plays everything I've thrown at it so far.
                                                                Digital Audio makes me Happy.
                                                                -Dan

                                                                Comment

                                                                • ajpoe
                                                                  Senior Member
                                                                  • Jul 2004
                                                                  • 439

                                                                  #33
                                                                  I too cannot hear any difference between Monkey and the original... I have never tried Flac.

                                                                  My system is still kinda old school, but it serves its purpose so I haven't felt the need to upgrade it. I have my OS on a 40 GB hard drive and all my music on a 2nd internal 250 GB hard drive. I have another external 250 GB hard drive that I only plug in to both the wall and computer when I want to do a backup of my music. That way my music is protected from lightning and such if my computer gets fried or the HDD just goes out. As of now, I only have about 450-500 full CDs so I still have room to keep adding music.

                                                                  I'll have to check out that Nero Ultra 7. I am still looking for the best software to manage/play/tag my music library.
                                                                  AJPoe - - Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional!

                                                                  Comment

                                                                  • audioqueso
                                                                    Super Senior Member
                                                                    • Nov 2004
                                                                    • 1930

                                                                    #34
                                                                    No, no... let me correct myself. Monkey, lossless compression, etc COMPARED to the original loses its soundstage. I don't know what FLAC is and have never tried it. If you listen to the original and then the ripped copy you'll see what I'm talking about. I think I will rip just the wave file today and listen just to hear the difference.
                                                                    B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                                                    Comment

                                                                    • VGuarino
                                                                      Member
                                                                      • Oct 2004
                                                                      • 69

                                                                      #35
                                                                      Originally posted by ajpoe
                                                                      ...ripped in lossless monkey's audio...I am using a trial of J. River's media center right now and I really like the tagging support and some of the other features it has such as album art downloads...

                                                                      Howdy...I've been doing the same thing (Monkey lossless and MC)....I like JRivers Media Center and just bought it. I had been using it for a while. The user interface is pretty good and very flexible. I use a laptop with a USB M-Audio sound card connected to my RSX-1056. The laptop runs MC and finds the server portion via Ethernet without any problems. JRiver has a nice licensing scheme as well. They allow you to user the software with all your systems. So you can add it to all of your clients and also the server.

                                                                      Vin

                                                                      Comment

                                                                      • ajpoe
                                                                        Senior Member
                                                                        • Jul 2004
                                                                        • 439

                                                                        #36
                                                                        Originally posted by audioqueso
                                                                        No, no... let me correct myself. Monkey, lossless compression, etc COMPARED to the original loses its soundstage. I don't know what FLAC is and have never tried it. If you listen to the original and then the ripped copy you'll see what I'm talking about. I think I will rip just the wave file today and listen just to hear the difference.
                                                                        I understand what you're saying... I still have not been able to notice any difference between a rip of monkey's audio lossless compression and the original CD. I'm not using a $5000 CD player, but I am running the signal through a DAC1 and they both sound the same to me.

                                                                        VGuarino, did you get version 11? I used the trial version of 11 for 30 days and then back to winamp when it expired. I really like the interface and tagging support of Media Center. I like how random works on winamp and the jump function for the playlist. I'm now using the trial version of Media Center 10. Version 10 is only $18 and I don't think I used any of the added features in 11... They seem very similar to me. I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I may give the Nero Ultra 7 a trial too before I decide.
                                                                        AJPoe - - Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional!

                                                                        Comment

                                                                        • aud19
                                                                          Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                                                          • Aug 2003
                                                                          • 16706

                                                                          #37
                                                                          audioqueso, are you listening ro the CD from your PC as well? Or playing from a different source to compare? If you're using a seperate player that's likely the difference right there
                                                                          Jason

                                                                          Comment

                                                                          • VGuarino
                                                                            Member
                                                                            • Oct 2004
                                                                            • 69

                                                                            #38
                                                                            Originally posted by ajpoe
                                                                            VGuarino, did you get version 11? I used the trial version of 11 for 30 days and then back to winamp when it expired. I really like the interface and tagging support of Media Center. I like how random works on winamp and the jump function for the playlist. I'm now using the trial version of Media Center 10. Version 10 is only $18 and I don't think I used any of the added features in 11... They seem very similar to me. I'm not sure what I'm going to do. I may give the Nero Ultra 7 a trial too before I decide.
                                                                            Yes, I purchased V11. It is much more stable than the previous versions. The only thing about APE is there is not much if any support for hardware. Other than using MC and a PC as your clients. I was just looking at Sonos which is a neat solution. They do support FLAC but not APE. They say there is not much call for APE.

                                                                            Vin

                                                                            Comment

                                                                            • VGuarino
                                                                              Member
                                                                              • Oct 2004
                                                                              • 69

                                                                              #39
                                                                              Originally posted by audioqueso
                                                                              No, no... let me correct myself. Monkey, lossless compression, etc COMPARED to the original loses its soundstage. I don't know what FLAC is and have never tried it. If you listen to the original and then the ripped copy you'll see what I'm talking about. I think I will rip just the wave file today and listen just to hear the difference.
                                                                              I have listened to ripped wav files vs ape vs the original CD. I've sat for hours comparing and using an SPL to ensure I had the same listening level. I cannot tell the difference. That doesn't mean there is no difference.

                                                                              I just can't hear any differences. Which might be considered a good thing

                                                                              Vin

                                                                              Comment

                                                                              • audioqueso
                                                                                Super Senior Member
                                                                                • Nov 2004
                                                                                • 1930

                                                                                #40
                                                                                Originally posted by aud19
                                                                                audioqueso, are you listening ro the CD from your PC as well? Or playing from a different source to compare? If you're using a seperate player that's likely the difference right there
                                                                                Playing the CD drive from my computer? Of course not. lol
                                                                                It's my computer (Hercules soundcard using the optical output to the Marantz) playing the ripped files vs my CDs on my Pioneer Elite. I don't have a $5000 CD player. Cables are DH Labs from both sources. My system is nice to me, but it's not that nice compared to others, so I don't see why some of you don't hear it. I doubt it's me cause my wife can hear it too.
                                                                                B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                                                                Comment

                                                                                • audioqueso
                                                                                  Super Senior Member
                                                                                  • Nov 2004
                                                                                  • 1930

                                                                                  #41
                                                                                  I actually ripped some wave files again last night... but I didn't get a chance to listen to it against the original source. lol I'll try to do that tonight.
                                                                                  B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                                                                  Comment

                                                                                  • ajpoe
                                                                                    Senior Member
                                                                                    • Jul 2004
                                                                                    • 439

                                                                                    #42
                                                                                    Originally posted by audioqueso
                                                                                    Playing the CD drive from my computer? Of course not. lol
                                                                                    It's my computer (Hercules soundcard using the optical output to the Marantz) playing the ripped files vs my CDs on my Pioneer Elite. I don't have a $5000 CD player. Cables are DH Labs from both sources. My system is nice to me, but it's not that nice compared to others, so I don't see why some of you don't hear it. I doubt it's me cause my wife can hear it too.
                                                                                    This is exactly what aud19 was talking about. You are comparing two different sources. It's not because the disk actually sounds better, it's because the CD player does. To get an equal comparison, you'd need to listen to the CD in the computer vs the files on the computer because they will both be going through the same signal path. It should sound identical. That's why I purchased a DAC1 to put between the my computer and processor. It makes the signal coming from the soundcard much more on par with a high end CD player.
                                                                                    AJPoe - - Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional!

                                                                                    Comment

                                                                                    • PewterTA
                                                                                      Moderator
                                                                                      • Nov 2004
                                                                                      • 2901

                                                                                      #43
                                                                                      See it's funny I always do lossless from my PC through the optical to my Rotel RSP-1098, and to test it I play my CDs through my CA Azur 640c (and even have through the Rotel RCD-1072) using the digital connection...and they sound identical because the Rotel RSP-1098 is doing the decoding. Now if I listen to the lossless this way and use the analogs from the 640c/1072, then those sound different/better.

                                                                                      Lossless, means just that, nothing should be lossed during the compression/uncompression process...so it "should be a bit-for-bit" translation of the CD.

                                                                                      I would think/hope you Pioneer Elite CD player has better DACs in it than your Marantz receiver... hee hee.

                                                                                      I'm in agreeance with AJPoe, I would like to get the DAC1 to put inbetween, that would be about the ultimate for me. Just need to find a good price on it. hee hee
                                                                                      Digital Audio makes me Happy.
                                                                                      -Dan

                                                                                      Comment

                                                                                      • aud19
                                                                                        Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                                                                        • Aug 2003
                                                                                        • 16706

                                                                                        #44
                                                                                        Originally posted by audioqueso
                                                                                        Playing the CD drive from my computer? Of course not. lol
                                                                                        It's my computer (Hercules soundcard using the optical output to the Marantz) playing the ripped files vs my CDs on my Pioneer Elite. I don't have a $5000 CD player. Cables are DH Labs from both sources. My system is nice to me, but it's not that nice compared to others, so I don't see why some of you don't hear it. I doubt it's me cause my wife can hear it too.
                                                                                        Originally posted by ajpoe
                                                                                        This is exactly what aud19 was talking about. You are comparing two different sources. It's not because the disk actually sounds better, it's because the CD player does. To get an equal comparison, you'd need to listen to the CD in the computer vs the files on the computer because they will both be going through the same signal path. It should sound identical. That's why I purchased a DAC1 to put between the my computer and processor. It makes the signal coming from the soundcard much more on par with a high end CD player.
                                                                                        Exactly I'm willing to bet something in the chain of your PC is the culprit in the collapsing soundstage. Soundcard, or the optical cable your using or perhaps just added jitter etc. Do you listen from the analog outputs of your Pioneer or the digital connection? That could be the difference as well
                                                                                        Jason

                                                                                        Comment

                                                                                        • audioqueso
                                                                                          Super Senior Member
                                                                                          • Nov 2004
                                                                                          • 1930

                                                                                          #45
                                                                                          No, for comparing my CDs to the ripped files I use the digital output of my Pioneer. I usually use analog connections, but for comparing the two, I let the Marantz do all the decoding.

                                                                                          Both my sources use good cables. My sound card shouldn't effect it that much being that it's a pass-thru digital signal.

                                                                                          I've never played any CD through the computers CD drive just because I know it's inferior. Never gave it a thought. I'm very interested now in doing like ajpoe in putting a better DAC inbetween my computer and Marantz. But... I promise guys that I will do a test tonight to listen to the difference and report back.
                                                                                          B&W 804S/Velodyne SPL-1000R/Anthem MRX720

                                                                                          Comment

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