First Post(long): Ideas, Questions, and the verge of Insanity!

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  • xyzsurf
    Junior Member
    • Jul 2005
    • 14

    First Post(long): Ideas, Questions, and the verge of Insanity!

    Let me first say Hi! My name is Mike and I'm sure I'll be hanging around here quite often now as I get sucked even further into this monstrous money pit. After I got my first entry level system about 7 months ago, I've been getting deeper and deeper in. Now after having had some Dynaudio 52s at the local hifi, I'm hooked.

    My system is, like I said, entry-level. It consists of:

    HK AVR235
    Onkyo DVCP-702
    Polk RTi8
    Infinity CSW10
    Monster M1.4s Biwire
    Monster M1000D Silver Digital coax
    Monster M-Series Bass 550 sub cable

    I'm looking at upgrading, and I'm not sure where to begin and where to end. I listen to just about everything except country/rap, from classical to Zero 7 to Jack Johnson to Coldplay.

    I'm looking at redoing the whole system, except maybe the sub, and going to 5.1. Speakers, Pre/Pro, Source, Cables, etc. My budget will probably be $6-8k. As for speakers, I'm definitely swinging towards Dynaudio. 72s for main, 122C, and 52s for surrounds. I was blown away by how easily the 52s disappeared and how clear/defined they were. They were completely transparent and Oh so sweet. Granted they were running off like $15-20k worth of gear and in a heavily treated room. I do tend to lean towards a warmer sound, but still want something that is articulate and defined, which the 52s were. Are there any other speakers I should consider in their price range (about $4k...). Paradigm Studios? Revel Concerta? Focal Chorus?

    Then for Pre/Pro and maybe even integrated. I've looked at the Arcam AVR300 (like it for overall quality and ability to bi-amp fronts using 6/7th channel amps for more power). Rotel, Adcom, Parasound, etc. I've even considered getting something like the Halo A23 to hook up to my HK and run the Polks with for a cheap solution if I didn't get a whole new system. The Polks are already decent, but I'm sure they would clear up and open some with more power.

    I haven't even begun to look at Cd/Dvd players. As for cable, I've been looking at River Cable Flexygy 6 for the fronts and center. It seems to be an excellent cable for relatively cheap.

    Well, my head is spinning, I'm not sure where to start. Any help, ideas, opinions would be greatly appreciated! 8O

    Thanks!
  • aud19
    Twin Moderator Emeritus
    • Aug 2003
    • 16706

    #2
    You seem to be fairly well on track with pre/pro brands. You seem to have some speakers you like but I'll also recommend looking at B&W, Energy, Kef, PSB, Snell, Totem & Vienna Acoustics as well as the ones you already mentioned.

    Otherwise I'll throw a recommendation out for forum sponsor Cat Cables and give Jimmy at Next Level an email when you're closer to ordering gear

    For DVD players I'm a big fan of Denon players, mate that with a Benchmark DAC1 and it will kick-@$$ for music as well.

    As for a sub, if you upgrade I'd go with SVS or HSU.

    What are you doing for a display?

    Welcome to the money pit!
    Jason

    Comment

    • xyzsurf
      Junior Member
      • Jul 2005
      • 14

      #3
      Thanks!

      I listened to some B&Ws: CM series, 700s, 800s. They were very good, but no where near as open and transparent as the little Audience 52s. Also, does Totem use dynaudio drivers? They look almost identical. I still want to travel to as many dealers as possible and listen to everything that I can. The dealer with dynaudio here is going to let me bring some home to listen to them. :T

      As for Cat Cables and Next Level...? Have a web address? I can't find them on Google.

      Not 100% sure what I'll do for a display. I love Samsung's DLPs. Also am anxious to see what comes of the SED sets.

      Comment

      • aud19
        Twin Moderator Emeritus
        • Aug 2003
        • 16706

        #4
        Cat Cables has a link at the bottom of the page, Next Level at the top

        I believe Totem may use Dynaudio drivers for (some...all?) their mid-bass and bass drivers but they have "upgraded" crossovers, enclosures etc. If you like Dynaudio's they could be a good higher-end fit for you

        As for SED's I can't wait for them either, I've got a great stickied thread in "RPTVs, plasmas, and other monitors" http://www.htguide.com/forum/forumdi...aysprune=&f=10 with lot's of info :T However if you're going to want a display before 2007-2008'ish I'd sadly be looking elsewhere. They'll be too new and too expensive for the "average" person before that point IMO.
        Jason

        Comment

        • Shane Martin
          Super Senior Member
          • Apr 2001
          • 2852

          #5
          Of the ones listed in Aud19's post, I'd lean towards Vienna Acoustics although Dynaudio with the proper amplification is tough to beat. I wouldn't use a measily reciever with these. The sub I'd replace with something from HSU or SVS. If you are in the US, then SVS is the best value of the bunch. HSu is good too but they are not as authoritive on the bass as SVS tends to be but in Canada, HSU is a better value due to a distributor there.

          Given the current HD-DVD/Blu Ray trend, I'd be wary of spending much on a dvd player. Buying an external dac is not a bad idea though. I'd just get a quality cd player and then later once all of this HD-DVD stuff gets settled then get one of those.

          Cables/accessories: Not going to open up that can of worms.

          I'd focus on the speakers first then spend the rest on amplification and a receiver. Even an HK635 would hold you over until you could swing a pre Pro later. Doing it now will compromise your speaker budget and that I wouldn't dare do.

          Comment

          • aud19
            Twin Moderator Emeritus
            • Aug 2003
            • 16706

            #6
            Personally I'd wouldn't be holding out for BluRay or HD-DVD myself. Get a decent mid-level, $500-$1000 player and enjoy it. Unless one becomes a clear winner in the first 6 months to 1 year I think they'll just end up being internediates until something like holographic discs or something else comes along.
            Jason

            Comment

            • gd
              Senior Member
              • Jan 2003
              • 583

              #7
              Add Monitor Audio speakers to your audition list.

              Monitor Audio is a British manufacturer of Hi-Fi speaker systems, offering quality stereo home cinema systems, multi-room audio setups, bluetooth, and more.
              .
              greg (gd to you)
              .
              Without music to decorate it, time is just a bunch of boring
              production deadlines or dates by which bills must be paid.

              Frank Zappa

              Comment

              • Shane Martin
                Super Senior Member
                • Apr 2001
                • 2852

                #8
                Get a decent mid-level, $500-$1000 player and enjoy it.
                The only thing a $500-$1k player buys you is SACD and DVD-A. Picture Quality it does not buy you.

                Given how unpopular DVD-A and SACD are and what little titles are available, does it matter? It depends. To me it didn't matter so much.

                Given that if SACD/Dvd-A is not a big deal, then buy a good player like the Panasonic S77 or Oppo(depends on your application) and save your dough for better amps, better speakers yadda yadda.

                You could argue that it gives you better redbook but you are better off buying a dedicated redbook cd player than buying a Uni-Player.

                Best thing to do is go out and audition with your own CDs and decide what you like. IN\ the end, opinions are just that. While one guy doesn't like Monitor Audio, the next will. Same goes for B&W and whatever else you want to discuss.

                Comment

                • Tobias Funke
                  Junior Member
                  • Jul 2005
                  • 5

                  #9
                  Dynaudio are a fantastic choice of speaker, but they are power hungry and require plenty of current. You will need a decent power amp, especially if you have a large room. But you will be rewarded with clean and natural sound.

                  I currently have the 72's for front and the 122C centre, but sadly no Dyn's for rear's as yet. The soundstage is very open and high. These are perfect for music and very warm, which is important when playing with home theatre, as bright speakers can be annoying with 90 minute movies.

                  I have just upgraded my power amp and the speakers just keep getting better. You wont need to change your speakers at all in the future. Unless you want to.

                  Comment

                  • StefanColson
                    Junior Member
                    • Jun 2005
                    • 28

                    #10
                    I have extensive experience with Dynaudio studio monitors, and while I don't know how their home audio line relates to the pro stuff I'll say this: The Dyns I've tried are some of the clearest, most detailed speakers I've ever heard at any price point. While I've heard speakers that are more revealing (like Revels) I've never heard anything that clear that is as easy to listen to (Revels are very sterile sounding to me). Dynaudios are exactly what I look for in a studio monitor, but I wasn't very excited by them for recreational listening. They aren't the warmest speakers that I've heard by a long shot, and they tend to present things in a manner that's very clinical or analytical. I don't know if it's just my experience with them in the studio that I wasn't able to "turn off", but I know I wouldn't be happy with them in a rig for enjoyment, not work. They're my favorite monitors for working, but I didn't enjoy them for play.

                    Speakers are totally subjective, and while I might not like what you (or anyone for that matter) likes, all that matters is that you find something that makes you happy. Dyns are great speakers without a doubt, I just felt like offering up my opinion for some reason (not that you asked).

                    Comment

                    • xyzsurf
                      Junior Member
                      • Jul 2005
                      • 14

                      #11
                      Really appreciate all the input!

                      I'm intrigued by Totems now... A lot of their reviews read just like those of Dynaudio's, like Stereophile's review of the Rainmakers. I know I really just need to get out there as much as possible and listen to everything I can. Several others like the Revels pique my interest as well. I do understand the need for power.

                      What does everyone think would be best to do? Aside from the obvious subjective points. I guess its most feasible to take this in stages. Should I just upgrade the speakers now with my current amp/source until I can afford a nice amp. Then use my HK as the processor until I can afford a better one? With the source somewhere in between. Obviously the speakers would be underpowered, but I don't push them terribly hard.

                      Also meant to ask, how much power would be sufficient? Would the Parasound A52 be enough with 125 @ 8 ohms and 225 @ 4? I don't really want to go over $2k for an amp. If thats not enough then its probably the GFA-7805 with 300 @ 8 ohms... lol

                      :T

                      Comment

                      • Burke Strickland
                        Moderator
                        • Sep 2001
                        • 3161

                        #12
                        Hey xyzsurf,

                        Just seven months into HT and already upgrading... ... what took you so long? :>)

                        Welcome to the asylum! :>)


                        Burke

                        What you DON'T say may be held against you...

                        Comment

                        • xyzsurf
                          Junior Member
                          • Jul 2005
                          • 14

                          #13
                          Yea Burke! Thanks! Glad to be here! I think the addiction has begun. :B

                          What order would you guys say is best to do this in? I guess it would be better to ask, what will give me the most immediate returns for music listening since this is going to be a step-by-step process.

                          Speakers first, running off my current gear ----> Add a good multi-channel amp (Rotel RMB-1095?) using my HK as the processor ----> replace the HK with a good processor (Rotel RSP-1068?) ----> replace my Onkyo with a better cd/dvd player.

                          Or would you go ahead and get the RMB-1095 and use it to push my Polks until I get better speakers? I'm honestly sort of curious to hear what the Polks would sound like with better wattage. I know they're power hungry and the 1095 would give them 200 RMS... Polks don't get any recognition, but they're honestly not bad speakers, at least the RTi and LSi's aren't. They're warm speakers, not overly articulate, but they still seem to have decent definition. Especially considering that I picked them up for $280! :B I do want to replace them though.

                          Comment

                          • aud19
                            Twin Moderator Emeritus
                            • Aug 2003
                            • 16706

                            #14
                            If it was my money:

                            Speakers/sub first. Then Rotel, Adcom, Parasound etc. 2ch amp (150W-250W) for your mains (does your HK have preouts?) and run the surrounds/centre of the HK. Then a 5-ch amp (100WPC or higher) for 7.1 or bi-amp mains or second zone. Then a pre/pro, then source unit and/or DAC.
                            Jason

                            Comment

                            • xyzsurf
                              Junior Member
                              • Jul 2005
                              • 14

                              #15
                              Yea, speakers is what I was thinking would make the biggest difference right away. The HK has full 7.1 pre-out, so it would work. Is there any particular reason for getting the 2-channel amp first? I had figured on just buying a 1095 (seems to be best for $2k) and just using 2 of its channels until I got the full 5.1 setup. That way if I ever wanted 6/7.1 I can buy the extra amp rather than being forced to buy both to even get 5.1.

                              Comment

                              • aud19
                                Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                • Aug 2003
                                • 16706

                                #16
                                Well you said improving music playback was a high priority. A dedicated 2-ch amp will do that best IMO while utilizing your existing HK's channels for surrounds/centre. Besides unless you plan on running pretty damned high-end and close to full range surrounds 200WPC is overkill IMO. For my money I'd go for a better 2-ch amp for stereo play back and a good "medium power" 5-channel amp for the rest. Running your mains on a seperate amp will leave more headroom for the 5-ch amp to play with anyhow.

                                Now if we're talking dream "lottery" systems I'd likely go for 3-monoblock Brystons (or similar) for the the front three channels or heck maybe 6 of the to bi-amp them :P Then 2-stereo amps for the rear 4 channels
                                Jason

                                Comment

                                • xyzsurf
                                  Junior Member
                                  • Jul 2005
                                  • 14

                                  #17
                                  :rofl: LOL... yea right!

                                  I'm definitely trying to reign this in on some kind of budget. I had been slapping that idea around to some extent... Doing something like the RB-1080 for mains and then the RSX-1067 or maybe even the Arcam AVR300 which seems killer. Hm!

                                  There are so many options!!! 8O

                                  I don't even know what to do for speakers any more either! Dynaudio is still probably on top, but I want to hear the Totems, revel, paradigm, monitor, etc. My system is probably going to be 80/20 music/movies and I'm going to be running a sub, so I don't really need ginormous 3-ways up front. I've even been considering bookshelfs all the way around for their wonderful ability to completely disappear. Jeez! My head is spinning!

                                  Oh, do you know if the RSX-1067 is 4-ohm stable? I should think so, but I don't see it in the specs anywhere.

                                  Appreciate all the help!!

                                  Comment

                                  • aud19
                                    Twin Moderator Emeritus
                                    • Aug 2003
                                    • 16706

                                    #18
                                    If you're going to spend that kind of money you'd be better off with the 1080/1075 amps and 1068 pre/pro IMO. Go seperates and you won't look back. There's a bit better SQ but the biggest plus is easier (and more affordable) upgradeability down the line As for speakers 5 (or 7) identical speakers all around is great for system synergy, though not always practical. You may also want bigger towers up front for music listening sans sub. Really YOU have to decide that stuff though

                                    Oh and don't forget to give the Energy Verita's (and Connouisseurs) a listen
                                    Jason

                                    Comment

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